First "shop" setup

[JPHutchins]

Assuming that I'm working outside on a slightly slanted 10X20 foot concrete slab one mile from the pacific ocean (foggy) I believe that it is impractical for me to invest in a table saw as I would have to leave it outside to rust. I also have no experience in woodworking with power tools and do not believe it would be safe to teach myself.
My plan:
Get an old wooden table with solid four legs of support.
Get a circular saw http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... =100594811 ?
Clamps and any other odds and ends I'll need to get a long clean cut with a circular saw, not to mention angled cuts.
Proceed with my first power tool projects:
A 12U equipment (or amp) rack with casters and hinged/ or removable doors.
Next, a "cube" bookshelf for 12" LPs
Then, anything else I can think of to practice on before buying a router, good wood and moving on to OT15s and then T60 slims.

Does this sound practical - I'm confident in my attention to detail and safety, it just seems that everyone uses a table saw - can I get by with a good circular saw and router for these builds?

Thanks for the advice,
J.P.

[Frederic Gelinas]

Does this sound practical - I'm confident in my attention to detail and safety, it just seems that everyone uses a table saw - can I get by with a good circular saw and router for these builds?

Yes. I would add to that list: a powered drill, a try square and more clamps. The table saw only makes the work faster. If you take your time, you can be very acurate with a circular saw on a cutting jig.

[bzb]

My table saw has a marble top. No rust on the top. Blade would be a different story - but you can always bring that inside after you're done.

Personally, I wouldn't have any tools laying around outside, ever. Maybe you live in an area that you can do that kind of thing.

[JPHutchins]

Great, I should have mentioned that I have a drill. And angled cuts with the circular saw are just a matter of having the right jig and patience?

Good point about the saw table, bzb, but the machinery itself would just be covered by a tarp, and this fog gets serious. There is no way I can leave tools outside, but someone would have to be kinda crazy to steal a table saw over an iron fence...

Does anyone think that a good first project would be cutting the table legs so that the table is level on the slanted concrete? Maybe weight the bottoms into concrete filled buckets? A gut feeling tells me that a level surface would be safer when applying weight to a circular saw.

Does the work table need to be about 4ft x 3ft?

[bzb]

The table being level is probably your top priority. What type of slope are we talking here?

Personally, I just don't like the idea of a circular saw if you have the budget for a TS. I'd be inclined to building a "station" with an infeed, outfeed, and side support that you can just slide a portable contractor's saw into, then carry it back inside when the work is done. Cool thing about a setup like that is you could also mount a router in it, a sander, etc. If it's big enough, use it as an assembly table, too. Possibilities are endless.

[JPHutchins]

Something like this?
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/tls/2268798314.html
This is the only one I could find that wasn't already part of some larger table.

I can deal with the slant, it's not too steep. So, building the work table could be my first project; I mentioned this a while ago to a friend and they simply said, "how are you going to build a table without a work table." Especially pertinent if I need it use the TS.

[bzb]

I dunno, I think I'd stay away from that one. If you do go look at it, take a few tools to make sure the top is flat, the blade can be positioned at a perfect 90 and perfect 45, and use a mechanic's stethoscope to make sure the bearings and motor itself are still good.

Honestly, for $30 more you can get a brand new Ryobi that's a piece of crap, but probably would work as well as a vintage saw that wasn't maintained properly. Hit up some pawn shops in the area. There's a Bosch portable contractor's saw sitting in my favorite pawn shop for $150.

As far as the table goes - I'd build it normal and shim the top instead of making the legs different lengths.

[DJPhatman]

Will you please explain your decision to build OT15s and T60s? If you don't have room to build these monsters, where are you going to store them?

I have a really good feeling that you do not need OT15s or T60s. I urge you to post your intended usage and typical venue size. I also very strongly urge you to build cardboard mock-ups of the cabinets you intend to build. This will help you grasp the size of them, and how you will pack-transport them.

[JPHutchins]

Thanks for the help, guys. I'm getting the impression that most table saws can be mounted/expanded in a variety of ways? Not all of them are welded into the table or stand that they come with?

I'm really just looking to get that setup so I can start practicing and move onto speakers as soon as I have enough experience, still haven't locked down the designs or bought any parts (or plans, sorry Bill.)

I do have the space to store the speakers (and work on them) but my upstairs roommates were understandably opposed to my setting up a wood shop indoors. I use the garage here as a music studio (also slanted floors...) and wasn't keen on spraying dust all over my components.

Transport is a definitely a concern; because there are usually 20-30 people involved in organizing events I'm sure I can hire someone to lend a hand if I need it. I do understand the size quite well, I used to have 2x15 mains. Those we managed to put in a Honda Fit somehow...?

Anyway, the venues really vary in size, sometimes it's a warehouse basement with low ceilings, sometimes it's a truck warehouse with 80 foot ceilings that can hold 2000 people, sometimes a club. However, these events are almost always between 200-400 people. And then there are the outdoor events...not sure I want to get into that.

Keep in mind that this is just a hobby for me and I'll be starting out with something I need to do first (the equipment rack and bookshelf) and go from there once I get a feel for it. Several months from now when I start on the BFMs (actually leaning towards a couple PA SLAs first) you can try to convince me that I don't need T60s. I also have no problem with setting up delay lines to compensate horn lengths, so I *might* consider starting with T30s or Titans.

Bottom line is that nothing you say can convince me that I don't NEED the LAB 15 T60.

[DJPhatman]

So you are doing EDM/rave type gigs? Then the t60 might be for you.

BUT<--- That's a big but(t)

You will need sizable transportation for T60s. If you have the vehicle, get an enclosed trailer with a rear ramp door. I have pulled my 6X12 with a 1991 Dodge Dynasty 3.3l V-6. Scary, but do-able.

As for the OT15s? Obviously you are doing all recorded media, so you will not be doing Aux subs. Take the time to build DR280 with the 3012HO. It's a much better match with the T60 Lab 15.

[JPHutchins]

Yes, rave. I want the 280s but it's really a matter of skill. I thought 2xOT15s would be a good starter (for 2xT60 slim) and if I expand to 280s (with more T60) the OT15s could be mounted lower and *quieter* to fill in the front of the stage sound for the kids that have to be close to the speakers, apparently because they hate their ability to hear, probably a result of too much happy hardcore.

[Jim Van Streader]

JP I think you’re on the right track. As you said this is a hobby so what ever you do is ultimately correct as long as you derive pleasure from doing it. I agree the DR’s might be a tad much to chew first bite especially with all the other challenges you have, ie, slanted floors, no table saw, zero wood working experience. DR’s are hard enough in a fully equipped shop with level floors and all the goodies.

Another idea for your slanted ground work area would be to build a ground level deck over it. That would be a great first project. You could use long sheet rock type wood screws instead of nails which would make it easier to take apart if you ever needed to.

I think you’ll be very pleased with the OTop15’s and they are a very “doable” build with a circular saw. You’ll need a saber/jig saw for the baffle cutouts.

If you haven’t already, check out as many woodworking video’s on youtube and the like as you can. There’s also a good number of books out there some devoted to circular saws, some to routers etc. I’d also recommend a pair of ear muffs like shooters muffs as circular saws make a lot of noise. The muffs will make you feel more comfortable using the saw. Don’t forget the safety glasses either, shit in your eyes sucks big time.

If you have the money, another thing I would add to the list would be a small compressor so you can buy both a brad and a pin nailer. A small used compressor off CL and cheapy chuger nailers form Harbor Freight will get you going. You can leave the compressor in your garage and just run the line outside. The pin nailer with 5/8” pins was my second best purchase ever next to my sliding table attachment for my tablesaw. With the pin nailer you can do many things you can’t with the brad nailer. The brad nailer will be much easier to secure your joints as compared to drilling holes and using screws. But, I’m an opinionated mofo so I’m sure some will disagree.

Not sure I would start with the T60 as my first sub, just because it’s a monster and has monster sized panels. But what’s the worst that could happen? Just be safe and don’t cut any body parts off or shish kabob an eyeball.

[Tom Smit]

Hi JPH and welcome to the forum!

I was thinking that a shimmed-at-one-end plate that the table could fit into/onto would be a more mobile idea and would not make the table dedicated strictly to that slope. And about the table, if you had a second one, then one could be used for routing, cutting, and drilling....the other for assembly. In the first one you could cut a hole to fit in an insert to hang the router from with another insert to cover the hole when there is no router need.

A saw sled can go a long ways toward a cab build. But if you're serious about the T60 then a sled that is about a foot longer would work well, with a shorter sled for smaller panels and pieces. The circular saw can tilt up to, and sometimes more than forty-five degrees.

Lots of clamps come in very handy as well. Quick-clamps, F-clamps, pipe clamps.

How does the sea air affect the outdoor fasteners, btw?

[jswingchun]

Look around the EurekaZone for another option instead of a tablesaw.

www.eurekazone.com