Finally fired up the 200's

[Tim A]

After having them built for a couple of weeks. Between Harley's visit and our gig on Mackinac I've been busy as hell. Then the bad driver popped up on Tuesday. Kudos to Leland, he took care of it in short order. The new driver got here today.

I still haven't had the chance to wring them out, but I did fire them up through my Mackie just to get an idea. The very first thing I noticed was how incredibly flat the response is with 4 of them. I didn't even bother messing with EQ due to the crummy 9 band on the Mackie, but I can say easily enough that if I had to get by for the evening with no EQ, they would've done it.

Another surprise was the bass response with 4 of them. I built these unported to gain some lower mids since they'll always be used with a sub. Still, standing about 10' in front of them will yeild a decided chest thump. I know once I put them 2/side they won't have the same response, but it's sure fun to hear them in a group!

The sound is very clean and clear, just like the 250. Someday of I get the notion I may do an A/B to see how they stack up head to head.

I'll put them on my big system and get them dialed in on Saturday, they're going to a gig Sat night.

[vlad335]

I can't imagine what 4 of those sound like stacked. I have never heard a DR before, much less in an array. Probably best that I don't for awhile or the sawdust will start flying again.

So with horn cabs such as yours, response would flatten and extension would lower when stacked, correct?

What are you going to power these cabs with? Any plans to build more and go 4 a side?

[Tim A]

So with horn cabs such as yours, response would flatten and extension would lower when stacked, correct?

Yes, witness:

What are you going to power these cabs with? Any plans to build more and go 4 a side?

Right now a QSC RMX1450.

I plan on building 2 more for 3 per side, which will handle our larger gigs of 5-600 people. After that, hard to say. As of right now I have no need for them, but if something pops up I might. I'm considering getting into sound rental. Not so much where I rent the system out, but more like sound for hire, myself included.

I built the line array just to see if I could do it.

[fender3x]

Sounds really cool, Tim. Did you get any pics?

[Tim A]

Well holeeeee cow.....

I'm in the process of putting together different rigs that fit our jobs. I've been taking a lot of stuff, mostly for field trials on cabinets and such.

We have a gig in a pretty small room coming up this weekend and I wanted to see what kind of a 'compact' rig I could come up with.

I started with my Mackie 808M, which hasn't seen a gig in over a year. To it I added a small rack case holding a cheapie DOD crossover and a Carver PM100 for monitors. Connections were made like this:

808's mixer line out to the crossover
Crossover lows to 808 Amp 1
Crossover highs to 808 Amp 2
808 monitor send to the Carver

For cabinets I connected a pair of my crossfired DR200's and a single T-39, 22", 12LF. I chose the Titan over my T-24's for pack and set-up space.

It took a bit of tweaking with the limited EQ, but not too bad. I bumped the 63Hz slider about 3dB and the 126 about 1-2dB. On the crossover I left the highs flat and boosted the sub about 3 more dB. This isn't surprising when you consider a single Titan at 10ohms was trying to keep up with 2 DR200's running at twice the power. Also, I'm going to guess the room size (15 x 18 ) was cancelling some bass. A larger room may need less boost.

9 bands doesn't offer a whole lot of adjustment, but after a bit of messing around in the 1-8kHz range it fell in pretty good. So good, in fact, I ended up listening to dang near the entire Dark Side of The Moon CD with the system cranked prettty loud, which irritated my daughter to some degree...

To make life easier, the 4 patch cords were zip-tied together and labeled. They'll stay connected to the crossover and monitor amp, so all I need to do is connect the free ends to the Mackie.

It's hard to believe just how good this little system sounds. For small gigs in rooms to 125-150 people I'd trust it without hesitation.

I love the way it all sounds on my normal rig, but after hearing what they'll do with this easy to haul/quick set-up, I have no concerns about using it for a quick in and out.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

9 bands doesn't offer a whole lot of adjustment, but after a bit of messing around in the 1-8kHz range it fell in pretty good. .

I ran mine set to flat via my parametric in the 01v, with the channel EQs handling the individual mics etc. I left one parametric band free to use as a room-boom notch filter, on set up all I had to do was sweep the frequency until I found the resonant frequency for that room and I was done. Never more than 30 minutes from out of the car to ready to play.

[WB]

on set up all I had to do was sweep the frequency until I found the resonant frequency for that room and I was done.

This sounds interesting and useful. What sound or tone do you use for the sweep? A sweepable sine Wave?

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

on set up all I had to do was sweep the frequency until I found the resonant frequency for that room and I was done.

This sounds interesting and useful. What sound or tone do you use for the sweep? A sweepable sine Wave?

I hum into a mic. If there's a room-boom resonance you'll hear it. Match the pitch of your humming to the resonance, sweep the frequency between 120 and 300 Hz or so until it disappears. Low tech, but very effective.

[mloretitsch]

on set up all I had to do was sweep the frequency until I found the resonant frequency for that room and I was done.

This sounds interesting and useful. What sound or tone do you use for the sweep? A sweepable sine Wave?

I hum into a mic. If there's a room-boom resonance you'll hear it. Match the pitch of your humming to the resonance, sweep the frequency between 120 and 300 Hz or so until it disappears. Low tech, but very effective.

Again proving that your voice and a mic are some of the most effective sound tools you own.

[bgavin]

Tim,

What is your general take on the feel and handling of the DR200 compared to your larger DR?

It appears the DR200 is about 4" smaller in all directions than DR250, and 6" smaller than DR280.

Any downside?

[Tim A]

Tim,

What is your general take on the feel and handling of the DR200 compared to your larger DR?

It appears the DR200 is about 4" smaller in all directions than DR250, and 6" smaller than DR280.

Any downside?

None regarding handling. They're so small and light it's easy to get them up on a stand, even if the stand is 7' high.

They're actually 4" shorter, 4" shallower, but only 2" narrower. Still, it's surprising how much of a difference that makes when they're setting next to the 250's. Even though I think of 250's as relatively small-medium cabs, it makes the 250's look pretty big.

HOWEVER, I have not yet had the chance to A/B them with the 250's sound-wise. I can tell you that by themselves they sound great, definitely clean and clear like the 250's. There is a decided drop off in bass, no doubt about it. One of the reasons I bought the cheapie DOD even though it only goes down to 100Hz is that it's fine for the 200's and OTop 12's.

As soon as I have the chance I plan on doing a direct side by side. Here's what I'm anticipating, I'll put it out there now and see how good I can guess:

1) One DR200 will not keep up with one DR250
2) Two DR200's will beat one DR250
3) The DR250 will pound the 200's in bass response. (my 250's are ported, the 200's are not, I'm going to have to plug the ports on the 250 to get an apples-for-apples comparison)
4) Once a sub is used, the difference will be negligible, or maybe non-existent.

To me, it only makes sense if 2-200's can beat a single 250. IF they can't, then my 200's will be relegated to small jobs and I'll increase my stable of 250's. From a response standpoint there's only a difference of 1dB, and power handling is 25w less on the 200. Maybe they'll A/B closer than I think as single cabs.

[SoundInMotionDJ]

They're actually 4" shorter, 4" shallower, but only 2" narrower. Still, it's surprising how much of a difference that makes when they're setting next to the 250's. Even though I think of 250's as relatively small-medium cabs, it makes the 250's look pretty big.

I did a very quick mock up of a box to size DR200's and DR250's. It was surprising how much of a difference there is between the two boxes. I can get 4 DR250's in the back of the SUV, or 6 DR200's (with all the other stuff I need to take...including 4x T39 @ 14").

HOWEVER, I have not yet had the chance to A/B them with the 250's sound-wise. I can tell you that by themselves they sound great, definitely clean and clear like the 250's. There is a decided drop off in bass, no doubt about it.

As I'm getting ready to start building tops, I am very interested in a A/B of the DR200 and the DR250.

If the DR200 is good to go in a 2:1 ratio, that's good enough for me. Based on the charts, it looks like DR200/250 in a 3:2 ratio might be about even too.

--Stan Graves

[Tim A]

Based on the charts, it looks like DR200/250 in a 3:2 ratio might be about even too.

--Stan Graves

That's what I'm anticipating (hoping). I'd be pretty comfy running three of them off one side of an amp at 2.7 ohms.

The rest of the comparisons stack up thusly:

3-200's Weight, 96 lbs. Power handling, 675w. Pack space, 11.25 Cu Ft. Array height, 54"

2-250's Weight, 88lbs. Power handling, 500w. Pack space, 12.32 Cu Ft. Array height, 44"

Weights are based on my cabs.

If they test out as hoped, three 200's have a clear advantage.

[dextermcneil]

... snip...

I did a very quick mock up of a box to size DR200's and DR250's. It was surprising how much of a difference there is between the two boxes. I can get 4 DR250's in the back of the SUV, or 6 DR200's (with all the other stuff I need to take...including 4x T39 @ 14").

... more snipping...

--Stan Graves

OK, I gotta ask - What make SUV did you put 4 DR250s and 4 T39 cabs into?!? That's gotta be one big car!

[SoundInMotionDJ]

OK, I gotta ask - What make SUV did you put 4 DR250s and 4 T39 cabs into?!? That's gotta be one big car!

The SUV is a 2003 Chevy Trailblazer EXT. Inside the SUV, I have 84L" x 28H" x 49W" to work with. The "EXT" is important here...since it adds another 16" of length behind the front seats, and about 2" of additional head room.

I only have the T39's right now...the DR's are in the planning stage. The T39's are 14" wide. I've mocked up some DR250's using 1"x2" stick frames....that's how I know I can fit 4x DR250 in there.

--Stan Graves