Increase the output of your amps!??

[escapemcp]

Saw this http://www.prosoundweb.com/article/figh ... elivered_/ and the theory seems good, along with the author (Dave Rat... he knows a thing or two ). It all seems to makes sense... I am going to have to rejig how I run my amps!

Thought it worth sharing with you guys.

[escapemcp]

On second thoughts, would this create more 'stress' on the amp??
I am OK for power on the tops, so I don't think I'll need this until I run 2 subs per channel (coming soon!! ). The iNuke's power rating of 625W into 4ohms is right on the 50V limit (and that's probably only measured with one channel loaded), so any extra little benefit will help (as long as it doesn't blow the amp due to an 'uneven' load).

[Grant Bunter]

Well, rather than try it on cabs, grab a tone generator, oscilloscope etc and use the same method Mr Ratt did.
I only say this, because, I'm not sure that the Crest amp mentioned is in the same configuartion as the Inuke.
The Inuke is Class D and switch mode power supply right?
I think that's different to the Crest.

You'd want to know exactly what's going on...

[escapemcp]

Well, rather than try it on cabs, grab a tone generator, oscilloscope etc and use the same method Mr Ratt did.
I only say this, because, I'm not sure that the Crest amp mentioned is in the same configuartion as the Inuke.
The Inuke is Class D and switch mode power supply right?
I think that's different to the Crest.

You'd want to know exactly what's going on...

Yeah, Class D & SMPS. I'd be happy to test, but it's really got to be done under load... how do I emulate that? I don't have an oscilloscope either. I could just run 50Hz @ 50V through my cabs and listen for distortion

I don't think the iNuke has massive caps... if that's the case then it may well run out of energy stored in the caps quite quick. Hence this possibly working. I dunno... I understand all the principles of how all this works, but I'm not too good on the details when it's time to investigate closely! I DO know that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing though, so I'm treading carefully!

[BrentEvans]

I believe that the Peavey IPRs do this already. If you look up bridging these amps, the method is to feed both channels the same signal, setting the attenuators the same, and connect to the positive out of both terminals. This would have to mean that the second channel is polarity reversed internally, which is neat.

Gotta say again how much I love these amps!

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

There's nothing new there. It's called a push-pull circuit, and it's how virtually every amp is made, the main exception being SET (Single Ended Triode). With a two channel amp you don't have to jump through hoops to do it, you just push the 'bridge' button.

[Radian]

IMO, if someone is truly fussing over coaxing an extra 0.8 dB of gain out of a power amp at its bleeding edge, perhaps it's time to step up to the next sized chassis or improve the sensitivity of the rig elsewhere.

Nothing against Dave Rat. When he speaks, I listen....but the practicality of this tip has me a little baffled.

[Grant Bunter]

IMO, if someone is truly fussing over coaxing an extra 0.8 dB of gain out of a power amp at its bleeding edge, perhaps it's time to step up to the next sized chassis or improve the sensitivity of the rig elsewhere.

Nothing against Dave Rat. When he speaks, I listen....but the practicality of this tip has me a little baffled.

Well put Radian.

For me, the absolute worst thing about following this route, as described in the article, would be the PITA that comes from changing x amount of my speaker leads, or making adaptors, and storing them in yet another box.
Especially after the time I have spent over the last 6 months or so making sure every amp output and cab is now speakon (as well as every XLR in the entire system now being pin 2 hot).

[escapemcp]

IMO, if someone is truly fussing over coaxing an extra 0.8 dB of gain out of a power amp at its bleeding edge, perhaps it's time to step up to the next sized chassis or improve the sensitivity of the rig elsewhere.

I DO need to get more amps/speakers, but another amp isn't a luxury that I can afford at the moment. I AM building another pair of T30s, so that should help somewhat
As for the PITA that is adaptors/specalized leads, I was just going to mark an XLR and a speakon with a bit of my luminous yellow gaffa tape and I'd know they are the reversed cables.
I admit that for 0.8dB, it's hardly a massive increase, but the free party crowd like it as loud as possible! I'll report back here IF I do ever try this.

[slyslam]

I started using this method for my subs about two years ago. No complain so far. I run a EP2500 with 4 T39 and and I see a bit more headroom when pushed to maximum. Could be a placebo effect but didn't cost me anything to try. I have my amp bridged, channel A speaker connected with a speakon and I used a banana plug for the reversed channel B.

[Grant Bunter]

I started using this method for my subs about two years ago. No complain so far. I run a EP2500 with 4 T39 and and I see a bit more headroom when pushed to maximum. Could be a placebo effect but didn't cost me anything to try. I have my amp bridged, channel A speaker connected with a speakon and I used a banana plug for the reversed channel B.

Glad to hear real world results.
AFAIK, using a brick wall limiter means no headroom when pushed to maximum.
When you're up to maximum limited voltage, that's it.
What limiter are you using?

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

I admit that for 0.8dB, it's hardly a massive increase

To say the least, since you can't hear a 0.8dB increase.

[Charles Jenkinson]

I watched one of Dave Rat's videos once, after hearing of him on here. It was about setting up a system with subwoofers. I was surprised that horns were passed off as 'no-one uses them anymore' - exit stage left and wheel in your twin 18's approach. I didn't get to the end of the video. I concluded he probably isn't a closet BF fan and whilst he might know his stuff, I was disturbed by what he said, when horn subs make more sense from a performance perspective. I'm not meaning to be critical, just to make the point that I feel i have a small mountain to climb on credibility with Dave, and thats probably more my issue.

Monday morning confessional over.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

I watched one of Dave Rat's videos once, after hearing of him on here. It was about setting up a system with subwoofers. I was surprised that horns were passed off as 'no-one uses them anymore' - exit stage left and wheel in your twin 18's approach.

Since you bring it up, he also hung onto cluster arrays long after they'd been abandoned by every other major tour sound operator. Kind of like Function1 he claimed the superiority of his cluster arrays because that's all that he had, and he tried milking them long after they'd gone dry. When finally forced to go to line arrays or go out of business he embraced them wholeheartledly. In short, Dave promotes what Dave uses. That doesn't diminish his capabilities as an FOH engineer, but you do have to take many of his recommendations with respect to gear as being subjective rather than objective.