New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

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Jon Barnhardt
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#46 Post by Jon Barnhardt »

88h88 wrote:I was under the impression that these new fangled 'digital' amps didn't like generators all too much. .
All the more reason not to use those amps. :owned:

Most quality generators will work. Think Honda, Onan, Yamaha. Move Coleman and Powermate to the bottom.

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escapemcp
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#47 Post by escapemcp »

88h88 wrote:I was under the impression that these new fangled 'digital' amps didn't like generators all too much. .
Yeah, hence my questions! I was planning on a 'suitcase' genny (the ones with an inverter) to generate the leckky... I *think* that if they cannot put out enough electricity, they just trip and cut off the power in an instant, rather than a flywheel genny, which will slowly reduce volts or Hz until it dies, resulting in a blown class D amp! :cop: The article where I saw these figures is http://forum.speakerplans.com/behringer ... 69202.html. The 24A figure (mentioned toward bottom of 1st page in the section when he's testing the 4ohm output) was when amping a sine wave at full power, so I suppose it is not 'real world', but I don't want to be worrying every time a heavy bass line hits :(
And on a happier note :cowboy: Bill, I have just sent money in your general direction!! Looking forward to receiving the plans :) :clap: :noob: :hyper: :fruit:

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escapemcp
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#48 Post by escapemcp »

escapemcp wrote:And on a happier note :cowboy: Bill, I have just sent money in your general direction!! Looking forward to receiving the plans :) :clap: :noob: :hyper: :fruit:
Thanks Bill.. VERY fast turnaround! :)

Grant Bunter
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#49 Post by Grant Bunter »

You'll find power consumption/requirements in this:

http://www.behringer.com/assets/NU1000_ ... ochure.pdf
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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escapemcp
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#50 Post by escapemcp »

Grant Bunter wrote:You'll find power consumption/requirements in this:

http://www.behringer.com/assets/NU1000_ ... ochure.pdf
Yeah, I have seen that but I have 2 issues with it:

1) It's Behringer's specs, which we all know are a little off
2) Because power is a function of time, if they have measured the power over a minute, or even a few seconds, you never get the INSTANTANEOUS power figure (which is what will stall or trip my genny - especially if it is an inverter one as they have no heavy flywheel for power storage through inertia of the wheel). This is just like the RMS/Program/Peak values that we all see on speakers and amps. A 1000W amp with 6dB headroom can supply a 4000W peak (yes?), but is still a 1K amp, as that is what it can deliver CONTINUOUSLY. Now Behringer may say 210W consumption @ 4 ohms, but that means little (it is also (most probably), continuous). It's like trying to work out the top speed that I went on a particular journey only based on my average speed.

Have read through the plans (thanks for quick turnaround Bill)... now, time to start again and re-read!

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escapemcp
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#51 Post by escapemcp »

Need some (MORE!) help, this time regarding tools. I am about to purchase some bits and bobs that I need to build my first box (of several ;) )

So without further ado (as I am hoping to get stuff ordered today! :fingers: ):

JIGSAW: What am I looking for in a Jigsaw? 45 degree mitre cuts? Minimum recommended power? Laser sight (which apparently makes following lines easier, but that is the manuf. blurb, so may well be :bull: )

CIRCULAR SAW BLADE: For my Bosch PKS-54. I saw :roll: things like rip cut and negative rake mentioned. I assume that rip cut is cutting across the grain (but with ply, I am ALWAYS cutting across the grain or either plys 2 & 4 or 1, 3 & 5!). How many teeth?

Any input happily taken on board and very much appreciated.

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LelandCrooks
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#52 Post by LelandCrooks »

What's your budget? Bosch is the cadillac of Jigsaws. Just no comparison. I've run them all. Go to cpo outlets and buy a reman one. I prefer the barrel style over the top handle.
If it's too loud, you're even older than me! Like me.
http://www.speakerhardware.com

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Bas Gooiker
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#53 Post by Bas Gooiker »

I would invest in a router before a jigsaw. Just a simple one is ok, doesn't need to be anything fancy. To make your speaker cutout and round over etc. etc.

I use a very simple rather crude cuthing blade on my circular saw, as long as its a sharp blade its ok. But a lot of people here use finer cutting blades with a lot of teeth, for even smoother cuts.

This is what i use!
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This will be even better!
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Life is just a game, don't take it to seriously!

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Chris_Allen
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#54 Post by Chris_Allen »

Bas Gooiker wrote:I would invest in a router before a jigsaw. Just a simple one is ok, doesn't need to be anything fancy. To make your speaker cutout and round over etc. etc.
+1 This is great piece of advice.

I reckon the builds can be done with a circular saw, router and drill.

Having guide boards (see the plans) for multiple angles is also a big help. Having the guide boards square is absolutely essential - so take your time and do them properly.

Most circular saws are fine but you need to pay attention to the blade. One with a narrow kerf is a good idea, as long as it is sturdy.

The only thing that should be a battery is the drill! If you can get two drills, it will probably save you a lot of time in swapping bits.

Remember, cheap tools be a false economy if they ruin everything they touch.
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#55 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Chris_Allen wrote:
The only thing that should be a battery is the drill!
My circular saw, jigsaw and recip saw are all battery, as well as my drills. You don't need a corded saw to deal with 1/2 inch plywood.

Grant Bunter
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#56 Post by Grant Bunter »

escapemcp wrote:
Grant Bunter wrote:You'll find power consumption/requirements in this:

http://www.behringer.com/assets/NU1000_ ... ochure.pdf
Yeah, I have seen that but I have 2 issues with it:

1) It's Behringer's specs, which we all know are a little off
2) Because power is a function of time, if they have measured the power over a minute, or even a few seconds, you never get the INSTANTANEOUS power figure (which is what will stall or trip my genny - especially if it is an inverter one as they have no heavy flywheel for power storage through inertia of the wheel). This is just like the RMS/Program/Peak values that we all see on speakers and amps. A 1000W amp with 6dB headroom can supply a 4000W peak (yes?), but is still a 1K amp, as that is what it can deliver CONTINUOUSLY. Now Behringer may say 210W consumption @ 4 ohms, but that means little (it is also (most probably), continuous). It's like trying to work out the top speed that I went on a particular journey only based on my average speed.

Have read through the plans (thanks for quick turnaround Bill)... now, time to start again and re-read!
Arr see, now you have to read fully.
Switch mode power supplies cycle faster to keep power up to the rails, and since that's what Class D amps have as a generalisation:

It tells you in those specs what the fuse rating is, dependent on country model.

It's not about the maximum power your amp can output as transients, it's about the most power it can consume (before the fuse will blow) to produce that output

So if you have eg 240V power, the fuse is rated @ 6.3 amps. If the fuse does it's job, that means it will blow after or around 6.3 amps. Which means that maximum required power from your power source would be 1512W or thereabouts.
Given that, you would think that, with a little overhead a 2.5Kv genny (or inverter) should be ample.

I imagine you would be well into hard clipping if you were running the amp to a level that was making fuses blow, much less any inbuilt protection circuitry.

You're correct though, you do need enough power for instantaneous requirement. We can't run a small stick welder or a medium sized compressor on our (old) 2.5Kv genny on the farm. Most noticeably the compressor, where all the load is trying to get that motor to turn the piston over that very first time.
We can hear the motor on the genny bogging down with an electric drill or an angle grinder.
All these things though are motor driven tools, and I'm sure that a switch mode power supply isn't quite so demanding...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Chris_Allen
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#57 Post by Chris_Allen »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote:My circular saw, jigsaw and recip saw are all battery, as well as my drills. You don't need a corded saw to deal with 1/2 inch plywood.
My battery circular saw always struggled at 45 degrees through birch.
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

Ryan A
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#58 Post by Ryan A »

Not all battery powered stuff is created equal. I have the ryobi lithium ion battery 18V circular and it shreds just about anything it can sink its teeth into.

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Chris_Allen
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#59 Post by Chris_Allen »

ryan222h wrote:Not all battery powered stuff is created equal. I have the ryobi lithium ion battery 18V circular and it shreds just about anything it can sink its teeth into.
I have the same saw.
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

biggerrigger
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Re: New Build - T30s and then Otops to follow

#60 Post by biggerrigger »

You should try the PorterCable Lipo then. I have built 4 T39's and 4 DR250's and it is not showing any signs of slowing down on the angled cuts.
Built
4-25" Lab12 loaded T39's
2-DR250's Melded array
2-DR250's Flat array

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