first gig

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

I have a question for you guys. Will 15 band eq would be enough to tweak response of this system ?

a 15-band EQ is a good start, but a 31-band would be much better. The 15-band just isn't precise enough to catch some of the peaks and valleys inherent in the design of these cabinets.

31 band is better if you have the means of identifying where you need to make adjustments, an RTA being preferred. If you're doing it by ear 15 band is better.

[Landl.livesound]

I have a question for you guys. Will 15 band eq would be enough to tweak response of this system ?

a 15-band EQ is a good start, but a 31-band would be much better. The 15-band just isn't precise enough to catch some of the peaks and valleys inherent in the design of these cabinets.

And to go even further a fully parametric EQ is *the choice* of EQ to use when tuning a system. Even a 1/3rd octave GEQ can end up being not be precise enough for actual tuning of a system, which I have found myself. This could be helpful, since as it has been mentioned, there are some decent peaks and valleys in the DR and Omni cabs that can be cleaned up that make them sound much better. A 1/3rd octave GEQ is great for having in your FOH rack and making some cuts at sound check that are different in each room you go into.

Of course if you only use a 1/3rd octave RTA to measure your cab for tuning, it will not be able to tell the whole story, which is why an RTA has no place in the serious tuning of a rig.

It all depends on how serious and how "ignorant" you want to be of what is really going on with your system. As they say, "Ignorance is bliss". But the more I dig and measure the more I realize just how much I don't know.


Take Care!

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

But the more I dig and measure the more I realize just how much I don't know.

It took three years but you finally said something I can agree with.

[Les Webb]

But the more I dig and measure the more I realize just how much I don't know.

It took three years but you finally said something I can agree with.

+1

[Landl.livesound]

But the more I dig and measure the more I realize just how much I don't know.

It took three years but you finally said something I can agree with.

Oh, I've know and said this since the beginning, since I've been on PSW/BFM/DJ Forums... which is still only about 4 years. (I will give you the benefit of the doubt that you just must have missed it the first couple of times.)

And it is true for all of us in this industry. It is always amazing to hear someone like Tom Danley, Dave Rat, John Meyer, David Gunness type say something like this and you realize how true it is for anyone like you or me, that we can never know everything, so the sooner we admit this and try our best to find an honest humility, the more myself, you, or the next person end up actually learning.


And by the same token, I have the deepest gratitude for someone like the Tom Danley, Dave Rat, John Meyer, David Gunness who takes time to post and teach and at the same time have no ulterior motive but to share knowledge with someone like myself who is just yearning for more things to learn to do the best that I can at something I have a passion for.


Take Care!

(I suppose I should have said the more *one* digs and learns the more *one* realizes just how little they know. Going along with it as it being not practical to think that you can completely tune and align a rig using a 31-band GEQ and RTA.)

[David Sample]

"And as far as just EQing to what you think sounds good - well - that's the whole point! Who cares if it's flat response, as long as it sounds good!"

Dude, I heard that!!!!!! I have a few friends who have told me that they paid some audio specialist to come to their home and use an RTA mike to set their system flat. I politely inform them that the human ear doesn't work that way, that it's designed to be especially efficient in the human speech range which is midrange, and that's why their system may lack the punch down low and the crystal clear highs while at the same time having that grating, fatiguing midrange!!!!!

[Zack Brock]

rec, How did your gig go, since this is an old thread?

By the way, I find the AutoEQ on the DriveRack's works best when outdoors, then use the ParaEQ on the driverack to EQ to taste when indoors.

[Gregory East]

Ha, speaking of parametric EQ, there's a relatively affordable processor that has 5 bands of +-15dB @ 12db/octave to go with the Xovers and limiters. Any use?

http://www.directproaudio.com/images/pr ... rive34.pdf page 17

[Greg Plouvier]

I've had good luck with a couple of Alto pieces. They're part of Yorkville. For the money it doesn't look too bad although the 2.3 would probably be more applicable for most folks around here.

[Zack Brock]

"And as far as just EQing to what you think sounds good - well - that's the whole point! Who cares if it's flat response, as long as it sounds good!"

Dude, I heard that!!!!!! I have a few friends who have told me that they paid some audio specialist to come to their home and use an RTA mike to set their system flat. I politely inform them that the human ear doesn't work that way, that it's designed to be especially efficient in the human speech range which is midrange, and that's why their system may lack the punch down low and the crystal clear highs while at the same time having that grating, fatiguing midrange!!!!!

Flat EQ is just a starting point, not a destination. You start flat and then EQ to taste, either with additional adjustment to the 31 band EQ or a parametric.

Flat without adjustment to taste is only useful in studios and the like. It typically doesn't sound good to most people.

[rec]

Sorry it took me so long to post my results. I would say that the gig went very well.
The pair of OT12's provide way more than enough volume. Even the pair of t30's had to be realed in a little.
I really had them cranked up to start and my wife looked at me and said "you need to turn the bass down"
at that point I knew that all was well.....muuhaha haaaaa! They were vplated and wall loaded. The OT12;s were
basically idling and the subs(t30's) were not being pushed very hard either. I cannot even imaging 4 of each.
Thanks to everyone's help
I still need to find a weekend and set up and continue to play with the EQ settings

[David Sample]

[quote="Zack Brock"][quote="David Sample"]"And as far as just EQing to what you think sounds good - well - that's the whole point! Who cares if it's flat response, as long as it sounds good!"

Dude, I heard that!!!!!! I have a few friends who have told me that they paid some audio specialist to come to their home and use an RTA mike to set their system flat. I politely inform them that the human ear doesn't work that way, that it's designed to be especially efficient in the human speech range which is midrange, and that's why their system may lack the punch down low and the crystal clear highs while at the same time having that grating, fatiguing midrange!!!!![/quote]

Flat EQ is just a starting point, not a destination. You start flat and then EQ to taste, either with additional adjustment to the 31 band EQ or a parametric.

Flat without adjustment to taste is only useful in studios and the like. It typically doesn't sound good to most people.[/quote]

Yes friend, I realize that. The people that I'm speaking of KEEP their's flat despite their own ears because they believe that's what "audiophiles" do, and I've read more than a few articles over the years that suggested the same thing for those who wanted to be "in the know"!

[fvodo]

My own journey on this has taken a while. In summary:
I first started with EQ "flat". Realized it was WAY too bright.
Saw some EQ curves at good sounding small shows and large concerts (via iPhone FFT app). Saw that bass was generally boosted and highs generally cut. Took the "flat" EQ and turned up "bass" by 3 dB and lowered "highs" by 3 dB so the flat EQ line was pretty much straight but tilted (higher at bass, lower at highs). WAY BETTER.
Only other thing - Fletcher Munson - drop 2K-4K by 2-3 dB - helps diminish listener fatigue - especially at higher volumes.

This took me over a year. Sigh...
(I know this is overly simplistic - hope it helps at least a little - YMMV)