Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

Get the lowdown on the down low.
Message
Author
Doug86i
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:14 am

Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#1 Post by Doug86i »

Hi all,

I have 8x 24' wide Tuba 36s in a nightclub in the UK.

Unfortunately they have managed to pop 4 of the 3015LFs currently loaded into the cabs. Given that the cabs are installed and weight is therefore not an issue, is there another driver (perhaps one that can handle more abuse) which you recommend? Cost isn't as much of a concern as availability and robustness. My supplier is currently unsure when they will have 4x 3015LFs for me.

Many thanks,

Doug

Doug86i
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:14 am

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#2 Post by Doug86i »


Grant Bunter
Posts: 6915
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:12 am
Location: Ilfracombe Queensland Australia
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#3 Post by Grant Bunter »

Hi Doug,
Don't think I've "met" you before, but you must have been around for a while to have a bunch of T36's.
When were they built?

Normally I'd say "if you're blowing drivers, you haven't got enough subs", but if yours have lasted this long, then that hardly washes, i would say .
Forgive me, but the T36 was long gone as a cab when I got here. In the plans does it mention brick wall limiting and a voltage limit for them? If not, might be time to put a driverack in the system.

With proper limiting, you should then be able to get away with recones rather than buying new drivers...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

User avatar
Bill Fitzmaurice
Site Admin
Posts: 28673
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 pm

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#4 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Doug86i wrote: Thu Mar 16, 2023 2:41 pm Would this be suitable?

https://celestion.com/product/cf1540hd/
It would. But the bigger question is what are you using for a limiter? When correctly limited drivers will have a life span measured in decades. Without it they can be measured in hours.

User avatar
Seth
Posts: 2791
Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:06 pm
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#5 Post by Seth »

Grant Bunter wrote: Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:02 pm ...With proper limiting, you should then be able to get away with recones rather than buying new drivers...
+1
Doug, I completely agree with Grant. Definitely look into replacing the cone/motor assembly on the damaged drivers. And, definitely get your limiter situation dialed in to eliminate future problems.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Doug86i
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:14 am

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#6 Post by Doug86i »

Thanks lads,

I built 12 of the tubas back in about 2007, and they were the low end of our main system. In 2014 i upgraded to an MLA compact system and 8 of the tubas went into this nightclub.

System is properly limited though a soundweb blu, they don’t usually blow drivers. Issue was that the amps have dip switches that set the sensitivity and at some point they were either knocked or fiddled with.

Last time I looked into reconing 3015LFs it wasn’t really worth it but they have become more expensive since then.

I can buy those Celestion drivers quite reasonably, much cheeper than the eminence over here, and with a Qes of 0.323 sounds like a winner no?

Rich4349
Posts: 855
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:18 am
Location: Kankakee, IL

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#7 Post by Rich4349 »

Where in the signal chain do you have that Soundweb Blu? Shouldn't a properly arranged limiter prevent going over voltage limits, regardless of amp sensitivity settings?
Also, depending on how hard you've run them, isn't 15+ years of use pretty good, even for pro gear?
2 DR250s, 2 27" Lab15 T-60s, 2 30" Neo Titan 39s, 1 Autotuba...and looking for more!

User avatar
Seth
Posts: 2791
Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:06 pm
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#8 Post by Seth »

Doug86i wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:20 am ...Issue was that the amps have dip switches that set the sensitivity and at some point they were either knocked or fiddled with....
Ah, yeah, that'll do it. You may consider recalibrating the limiter settings to the amplifiers with those switches in their most sensitive setting to eliminate the issue from ever occurring again. That way, if someone get's to fiddling with the amplifier settings, the only thing they can do is reduce the output to the subs.

Good find on the Celestion... If the price is right, and it sounds like it is, could definitely be worth skipping the work it takes to install four new cones.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

User avatar
Seth
Posts: 2791
Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:06 pm
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#9 Post by Seth »

Rich4349 wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:20 am ...Shouldn't a properly arranged limiter prevent going over voltage limits, regardless of amp sensitivity settings?..
The limiter limits the low level signal voltage out of whatever limiting processor is being used. Any signal changes after that point will effect the output of the amp. If the amplifier input sensitivity selector (not all amps offer this functionality) is changed but the source level limit remains the same, the amplifier's output voltage limit will change.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 8340
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#10 Post by Bruce Weldy »

Seth wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 11:21 am
Rich4349 wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:20 am ...Shouldn't a properly arranged limiter prevent going over voltage limits, regardless of amp sensitivity settings?..
The limiter limits the low level signal voltage out of whatever limiting processor is being used. Any signal changes after that point will effect the output of the amp. If the amplifier input sensitivity selector (not all amps offer this functionality) is changed but the source level limit remains the same, the amplifier's output voltage limit will change.
Yep.....what he said.

We always say that we are limiting the amp, but in reality we're only limiting the input to the amp.....that's why we always say to crank 'em all the way up. The old Crowns always had the choice of input sensitivity.....and Seth's right that some still do.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

Grant Bunter
Posts: 6915
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:12 am
Location: Ilfracombe Queensland Australia
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#11 Post by Grant Bunter »

Doug86i wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:20 am Thanks lads,
I built 12 of the tubas back in about 2007, and they were the low end of our main system.
Love to hear that tribe!
Doug86i wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:20 amSystem is properly limited though a soundweb blu, they don’t usually blow drivers. Issue was that the amps have dip switches that set the sensitivity and at some point they were either knocked or fiddled with.
Good to hear you're limiting. Time to get the thinking cap on to work out how to stop that happening again me thinks, like a plate screwed or op rivetted onto the chassis if it will fit.
Doug86i wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:20 amLast time I looked into reconing 3015LFs it wasn’t really worth it but they have become more expensive since then.
Fair enough
Doug86i wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:20 amI can buy those Celestion drivers quite reasonably, much cheeper than the eminence over here, and with a Qes of 0.323 sounds like a winner no?
While lower Qes is better for horns, Xmax is only a little higher than the 3015lf. If you're happy with the output of the 3015lf loaded cabs, but change drivers to the Celestions, leave you limiter settings the same, you should get a little more insurance against blown drivers.
If you try an eek out a few more dB, you're back in the same boat...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

Doug86i
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:14 am

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#12 Post by Doug86i »

Thanks for the help.

I’ve ordered the celestion drivers and will report back once I’ve loaded them.

If anyone’s interested, I can get them for around £160 ex each in the UK.

All the best,

Dx

Doug86i
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:14 am

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#13 Post by Doug86i »

Just to close the loop here,

The celestion CF1540HD is very impressive. Build quality is on point and they sound great.
We had the chance to A/B the 4 of them with the 4 remaining 3015s loaded cabs and (given that the old drivers have had a long hard life) the celestion loaded cabs were subjectively 'tighter' and noticeably more sensitive. The extra power handling is a peace-of-mind bonus too.

Negatives are obviously weight and physical size of the magnet assembly. Plenty of space inside the T36s though. I'd have no hesitation in recommending the CF1540HD over the 3015LF for this cab.

Hope that helps someone x

Next time I'm at the club, I'll take some measurements for funsies.

Grant Bunter
Posts: 6915
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:12 am
Location: Ilfracombe Queensland Australia
Contact:

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#14 Post by Grant Bunter »

Cheers for getting back to us!

Glad to see you had some success too....
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

Aodhanmac
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2023 5:38 pm
Location: Co donegal, ireland

Re: Tuba 36 3015LF alternative

#15 Post by Aodhanmac »

Hello new to the forum, have been reading through some threads and couldn’t find what I was looking for. I having 2 tuba ht made… I have 2 Jbl 2226h 8ohms drivers and was wonder would they be suitable or a waste or even fit! in my HTs ?

Post Reply