Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

High power and fidelity from an easy to build cabinet.
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Tom Smit
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#241 Post by Tom Smit »

:clap:
TomS

CarterKraft
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#242 Post by CarterKraft »

Quarterly update!

I took it too work again for some other techs who hadn't experienced it before.
One of them is a outlaw ham radio guy who knows a little about sound. We got to the crowd choice part of the program and he requested a "sweep" knowing the other guys didn't know what what was and he thought it would be funny to bust their ears.

I dialed up a 30hz to 20hz sweep on a app I have (that I have never used) and held the volume UP button on my phone to the max...
It played the sweep and we all laughed at how stupid that was.
The next request wàs Michael Jackson Thriller and as I turned it up to about 7 it started for lack of a better term chopping the sound, maybe oscillating on off of the playback.

I tried a bunch of stuff thinking it was the app, the Bluetooth connection etc. but I couldn't fix it.
Low to mix volume it was fine. But after 5-6 of 10 I'd say it messes up.
I took it home reloaded the tune in the software and tried again, still broken... I tried tuning the tune, but nothing helped except it seemed like muting the tweeter. I tried disconnecting the tweeter which worked but obviously no tweeter sux.
I ended up deciding the amp was messed up. I contacted PE and explained what happened, the Tech agreed I might have exceeded the amplitude or some such and could have damaged the amp, he sent a new one out pronto and I replaced the amp loaded the tune to get the exact same results...
I created a completely different tune and it's still there.

So I'm at the point that either the tweeter died so I took it apart and didn't see anything obvious wrong.
I kind of abandoned it out of frustration but I was thinking the other day what about the protection cap? Could it be damaged and shorting the amp somehow?

I am ready to just buy a new tweeter and cap but I don't like throwing parts at stuff.
Any ideas? If I'm gonna get new anyway I may just pull the cap and test it it as is, if it blows the diaphragm no loss.
Weldon Carter

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#243 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Protection cap?

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Tom Smit
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#244 Post by Tom Smit »

The next request wàs Michael Jackson Thriller and as I turned it up to about 7 it started for lack of a better term chopping the sound, maybe oscillating on off of the playback.
Have you tried to replicate this on another device(not the sweep, though)? This would test your phone for being the problem. Have you tried other tunes?
TomS

CarterKraft
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#245 Post by CarterKraft »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Tue Sep 26, 2023 8:53 pm Protection cap?
The 10uf cap I installed in series earlier in the build that I thought was to protect the tweeter from errant frequencies that could damage it.
Weldon Carter

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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#246 Post by CarterKraft »

Tom Smit wrote: Tue Sep 26, 2023 9:48 pm
The next request wàs Michael Jackson Thriller and as I turned it up to about 7 it started for lack of a better term chopping the sound, maybe oscillating on off of the playback.
Have you tried to replicate this on another device(not the sweep, though)? This would test your phone for being the problem. Have you tried other tunes?
Yes, I have used several devices that all previously sounded perfect.

Yes, I created a completely new tune from scratch, obviously this was not EQ'ed to the level of the original but the tweeter didn't seem to care through out the build. At this point with a new amp/bluetooth receiver there is nothing retained in the signal chain.
I even ran it off line in cable no bluetooth at all.

I ran the power supply section off a AC/DC power supply removed all the battery power equipment with no change.
With no proof it seems like something is clipping the output.
Weldon Carter

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#247 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

CarterKraft wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 7:06 am The 10uf cap I installed in series earlier in the build that I thought was to protect the tweeter from errant frequencies that could damage it.
I doubt that it's damaged. Caps tend to either work fine or not at all. You've got clipping somewhere. It could be the amp, could be the source media. Clipping is always first heard in the high frequencies.

CarterKraft
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#248 Post by CarterKraft »

I'm at a loss as to where to go next. The amp/receiver board is completely new.
I suppose I could swap the mid and tweeter channel but a new complete unit should have tested that.
Weldon Carter

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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#249 Post by CarterKraft »

This "clipping" effects the low and mid but if I mute in software or just disconnect the tweeter it doesn't clip.

I am thinking the tweeter is busted and is shorting somehow? Sounds that way from my own explanation.
Weldon Carter

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Seth
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#250 Post by Seth »

Weldon, do you have any compressors or limiters in your DSP signal flow path?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

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Seth
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#251 Post by Seth »

CarterKraft wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 9:31 am This "clipping" effects the low and mid but if I mute in software or just disconnect the tweeter it doesn't clip.

I am thinking the tweeter is busted and is shorting somehow? Sounds that way from my own explanation.
It does seem to point this direction. Are you able to disconnect the tweeter and measure DC resistance across the speaker terminals?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

CarterKraft
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Location: DFW

Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#252 Post by CarterKraft »

Seth wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 12:20 pm
CarterKraft wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 9:31 am This "clipping" effects the low and mid but if I mute in software or just disconnect the tweeter it doesn't clip.

I am thinking the tweeter is busted and is shorting somehow? Sounds that way from my own explanation.
It does seem to point this direction. Are you able to disconnect the tweeter and measure DC resistance across the speaker terminals?
Yes I can do that. I feel like I should have done that already but can't remember doing that :bash:

I ordered a Dayton NEO 1" tweeter to test, not the correct part per the plans but will let me test and I will use it for another project I'm sure.
I need my TallBoy back!

https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Au ... quantity=1
Weldon Carter

CarterKraft
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#253 Post by CarterKraft »

Seth wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 12:13 pm Weldon, do you have any compressors or limiters in your DSP signal flow path?
No I didn't the only DSP I had in there was the dynamic bass module on the woofer.

But I got rid of all that stuff when I made the from scratch tune, only crossovers.
Weldon Carter

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Seth
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#254 Post by Seth »

CarterKraft wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 2:08 pm
Seth wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 12:13 pm Weldon, do you have any compressors or limiters in your DSP signal flow path?
No I didn't the only DSP I had in there was the dynamic bass module on the woofer.

But I got rid of all that stuff when I made the from scratch tune, only crossovers.
That rules out limiter pumping. :thumbsup:
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Bruce Weldy
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Re: Finally! Omni 12 Tall Boy build

#255 Post by Bruce Weldy »

Because I'm too lazy to dig back through 250 posts.......what is the mixer/amp configuration? You said receiver - is that what your using? I wouldn't go changing components in the cab until you rule out the signal getting hammered somewhere.

Almost every time a venue calls me because they say the speakers are distorted - it's because they are overdriving the input. I turn down the input, turn up the output and voila.....same volume with no distortion.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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