3015LF on JL150

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joblow88
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3015LF on JL150

#1 Post by joblow88 »

I aplied for a grant to make speakers and i just got aproved yesterday :hyper: . That mean that i had to look a all the kappalite go out of stock while i was waiting for the aproval because i could not spend the money before :wall: ... i can still get 3050lf tho. So i was thinking it should be all wright with Eminence F151M-8 tweeter crossed at 1.2kHz? Would it give me better low response in the lows with the added Xmax?
The plan would be to have a good little setup that i can trow in the back of my civic. Im thinking to make a pair of t48 or t30 for when i need more bass but that would be 30% of the time were most of the show i do are punk, metal or acoustic. I do like the deeper bass and the smaller foot print of the t30 but that is for an other post.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: 3015LF on JL150

#2 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

The 3015LF is a subwoofer driver. It's not really suitable for the J15.

Bruce Weldy
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Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#3 Post by Bruce Weldy »

Right now, the 2515 is available. I built a Jack 15 with and it was a good option.

Eminence has 27 in stock right now.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

joblow88
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2022 8:18 pm

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#4 Post by joblow88 »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Wed Apr 20, 2022 11:37 pm Right now, the 2515 is available. I built a Jack 15 with and it was a good option.

Eminence has 27 in stock right now.
Yup it is a good alternative
Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:19 pm The 3015LF is a subwoofer driver. It's not really suitable for the J15.
Even crossed at 1.2kHz? It is in the frequency range of the driver. I tought that maybe it would have better output in the low since i read this sentence quite often since i bought the plans ”Low frequency power capacity is determined by the driver excursion limit, xmax.”
It would be a good improvement for my use case

Bruce Weldy
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Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#5 Post by Bruce Weldy »

joblow88 wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 8:38 am
Even crossed at 1.2kHz? It is in the frequency range of the driver. I tought that maybe it would have better output in the low since i read this sentence quite often since i bought the plans ”Low frequency power capacity is determined by the driver excursion limit, xmax.”
It would be a good improvement for my use case
Bill will tell me if I'm right or wrong, but...

If you look at the charts for both drivers, you'll see that the 3012LF is less sensitive than the 2512 from 100hz to 1khz by quite a bit. To me, that means that the horn will outrun the woofer and the box will be a bit top heavy....

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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Seth
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Re: 3015LF on JL150

#6 Post by Seth »

I wish I understood more clearly the relationship between the raw driver response chart and how that translates to response in any particular cab. As it is now, my belief is the cab has more to do with final response than the raw driver response. But, honestly, I don't even know how true that really is. I suspect it's more about the combination, rather than one or the other. But still... what's the raw driver response got to do with anything. Other than identifying a drivers upper and lower frequency limits, does the respone graph shape between those 2 points translate over to "in cab" response?

Gonna have to add this to my list of things to test out.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: 3015LF on JL150

#7 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

The raw response is measured in a wall, so the only part of that response that translates to the final result is above roughly 200Hz, and then when it's in a direct radiator. Bruce has it correct, the loss of sensitivity above 200Hz is why it's not the right choice for other than a sub. OP, the J15 isn't a sub, so you need to stop approaching it as one. It's a main, intended to be used in a large format PA system with T30s, T45s, T48s or T60s. If that's not what you're doing with it you should consider a main that's better suited to what you're doing.

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Seth
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Re: 3015LF on JL150

#8 Post by Seth »

joblow88, tell me a little about the typical venue you'd be likely to play in/at.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

joblow88
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2022 8:18 pm

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#9 Post by joblow88 »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 3:27 pm The raw response is measured in a wall, so the only part of that response that translates to the final result is above roughly 200Hz, and then when it's in a direct radiator. Bruce has it correct, the loss of sensitivity above 200Hz is why it's not the right choice for other than a sub. OP, the J15 isn't a sub, so you need to stop approaching it as one. It's a main, intended to be used in a large format PA system with T30s, T45s, T48s or T60s. If that's not what you're doing with it you should consider a main that's better suited to what you're doing.
Thanks for that, it is enlightening.
Seth wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 5:02 pm joblow88, tell me a little about the typical venue you'd be likely to play in/at.
I would be mainly doing bush, barn, garage and basement shows with them in the of punk metal and acoustic scene. Crowd under 300 people mainly. I would like to have a sub reinforcement for when i want them like for small festival or electronic music events. Why i look into the jl15 is for the all around use i can make of them and the ease of transportation

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Seth
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Re: 3015LF on JL150

#10 Post by Seth »

joblow88 wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 11:57 pm I would be mainly doing bush, barn, garage and basement shows with them in the of punk metal and acoustic scene. Crowd under 300 people mainly. I would like to have a sub reinforcement for when i want them like for small festival or electronic music events. Why i look into the jl15 is for the all around use i can make of them and the ease of transportation
That sounds pretty cool. :thumbsup: Are these gigs something you're already participating in? If so, could you tell me a little about the gear you've been using and what improvements you'd like to achieve? Or, if it's more of a prospective plan for the future, do you have any other gear yet (Mixers, signal processing, amps, etc.) or is this a completely fresh start from the ground up?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 8301
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#11 Post by Bruce Weldy »

joblow88 wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 11:57 pm and the ease of transportation
I've built a Jack15 and it ain't easy to transport. It's a big square cab. I'd much rather haul around a T39 with wheels along with one or two OTop12s or even some SLAs or Simplexx tops. Build some smaller tops along with 2-4 T39s and just take what you need depending on the size of the crowd.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

joblow88
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2022 8:18 pm

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#12 Post by joblow88 »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 8:00 am
joblow88 wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 11:57 pm and the ease of transportation
I've built a Jack15 and it ain't easy to transport. It's a big square cab. I'd much rather haul around a T39 with wheels along with one or two OTop12s or even some SLAs or Simplexx tops. Build some smaller tops along with 2-4 T39s and just take what you need depending on the size of the crowd.
well i could put a t39 in the back seat of my civic but that would take pretty much all of the room for the tops. The trunk is pretty narrox at 16''. Also if i make sub i would rater go for t30 or t48 because i would like to go deeper in the bass when i make electronic events.
@Seth We have been using a pair of preamp 12'' from jbl that we borrow from our frind for the longest time. now we upgraded to a pair of mrx525 from jbl. amp wise i got 3 qsc rmx4050 and an other qsc 1500w

Bruce Weldy
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Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#13 Post by Bruce Weldy »

joblow88 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:50 am
Bruce Weldy wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 8:00 am
joblow88 wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 11:57 pm and the ease of transportation
I've built a Jack15 and it ain't easy to transport. It's a big square cab. I'd much rather haul around a T39 with wheels along with one or two OTop12s or even some SLAs or Simplexx tops. Build some smaller tops along with 2-4 T39s and just take what you need depending on the size of the crowd.
well i could put a t39 in the back seat of my civic but that would take pretty much all of the room for the tops. The trunk is pretty narrox at 16''. Also if i make sub i would rater go for t30 or t48 because i would like to go deeper in the bass when i make electronic events.
@Seth We have been using a pair of preamp 12'' from jbl that we borrow from our frind for the longest time. now we upgraded to a pair of mrx525 from jbl. amp wise i got 3 qsc rmx4050 and an other qsc 1500w
If you are using subs, there is no reason for 2x15 tops. Those boxes will go down to 50hz with no problem. A smaller box that crosses over at 100hz pairs up better if you are using a sub. Otherwise you are carrying around a huge box that isn't being utilized to it's fullest - might as well use a smaller box with the same output.

Big is not necessarily better - better is better. Pick the right tool for the job.

And if you can't fit a T39 in your vehicle, you danged sure won't be able to fit a T30 or T48.

I'd suggest you start with figuring out how much room you have to haul things, then build a system that fits your pack space. But those MRX525s really shouldn't figure into the equation.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

User avatar
Seth
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Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Contact:

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#14 Post by Seth »

joblow88 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:50 am We have been using a pair of preamp 12'' from jbl that we borrow from our frind for the longest time. now we upgraded to a pair of mrx525 from jbl. amp wise i got 3 qsc rmx4050 and an other qsc 1500w
Tell me a little about your opinion of the performance of the MRX525's. Do they do what you want them to do, are they lacking anything? Other than reducing pack space, what improvements would you like to achieve as an upgrade to the system?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

joblow88
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2022 8:18 pm

Re: 3015LF on JL150

#15 Post by joblow88 »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 11:58 am
joblow88 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:50 am
Bruce Weldy wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 8:00 am

I've built a Jack15 and it ain't easy to transport. It's a big square cab. I'd much rather haul around a T39 with wheels along with one or two OTop12s or even some SLAs or Simplexx tops. Build some smaller tops along with 2-4 T39s and just take what you need depending on the size of the crowd.
well i could put a t39 in the back seat of my civic but that would take pretty much all of the room for the tops. The trunk is pretty narrox at 16''. Also if i make sub i would rater go for t30 or t48 because i would like to go deeper in the bass when i make electronic events.
@Seth We have been using a pair of preamp 12'' from jbl that we borrow from our frind for the longest time. now we upgraded to a pair of mrx525 from jbl. amp wise i got 3 qsc rmx4050 and an other qsc 1500w
If you are using subs, there is no reason for 2x15 tops. Those boxes will go down to 50hz with no problem. A smaller box that crosses over at 100hz pairs up better if you are using a sub. Otherwise you are carrying around a huge box that isn't being utilized to it's fullest - might as well use a smaller box with the same output.

Big is not necessarily better - better is better. Pick the right tool for the job.

And if you can't fit a T39 in your vehicle, you danged sure won't be able to fit a T30 or T48.

I'd suggest you start with figuring out how much room you have to haul things, then build a system that fits your pack space. But those MRX525s really shouldn't figure into the equation.
No i dont plan to carry my t48 or t30 all the time, just haul them on a trailler when i need them for someting like 25-30% of the time. That is why i want to make a pair of JL15 at about 35lb each i can trow them on the back seat and they are good enough by themself. I tought about the omni full range but they dont fit...

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