BillFitzmaurice.info

Ok guys,
My wife started getting into Zumba about a year ago. Got certified to be an instructor and now knows a whole network of instructors in our area. Most studios have a sound system that consists of 1, 2 if they are lucky, powered speakers.

One instructor came by the house and the conversation lead to my TLAH's on my living room. Needs to say she was impressed with the clarity and loudness. She asked if I help her with her studio.

Naturally I want to help, but time to built subs and tops is something I don't have, so I told her we could slowly build her setup starting with a pair of 15" PA speakers that she had, but didn't have anything to power them.

The studio is about 25 x 40 with an extra room in the back of 15 x 10 that has an opening of 6 x 6. Ceilings are about 10"

At first I thought a powered mixer and the PA speakers, but then I started thinking adding a T30 or 2 in the future. Maybe some OTops after that.

The PA speakers are rated at 300 watts. I have talked to many instructors and they all complain about blown speakers. Obviously they get something that makes noise and they play it too loud

What would be a good starting point to future proof this system? I would like something simple, most Zumba peeps that may mess with the system have no clue.

Can a powered mixer incorporate a limiter? Am I better off starting with a 500 watt amp and a mixer, then add a subs, limiter, And amp at a later date?

Thanks in advance,

Oscar

An EQ is a must. You will need to tune for the room.
Because 'well-meaning' hands may touch the stuff, a limiter is a must.

I think some (most?) powered mixers have pre outs and amp ins that you could use to insert a limiter, but, if they can put hands on the powered mixer, they can unplug/defeat the limiter and let the smoke out of the boxes.

If it were me, I'd get a used Driverack PX. The Driverack and the amp go into a locked cabinet or closet. They can ham-fist the mixer all they want to and the limiter (and padlock) will keep the stuff from smoking.

One of the amps with DSP might also work, but the Driverack would allow easier expansion when more stuff is added...

Mixer? Probably any little sub $100 baby mixer would work. The fewer controls that can be touched, the better.

y2kindyz wrote: they all complain about blown speakers. Obviously they get something that makes noise and they play it too loud

Actually.....yes and no. It's not the overall volume that gets 'em - What they do is try to get more bass from a speaker up on a pole, so they boost the bottom end until the xmax is passed and that blows the speaker. With a proper crossover and subs, they will probably never blow another top box.

One or two corner-loaded subs along with a single power amp (lows on one side, highs on the other) run in mono, and a small mixer.....a driverack would give you limiting and EQ.

I'd stay away from a powered mixer in this case because of the more complicated setup in trying to come out of the mixer to a crossover, then back in to access the power amp section.....not something a lot of folk understand and can pull off.....anyway, you only need an input for music and one mic, right?

Bruce Weldy wrote:

y2kindyz wrote:

I'd stay away from a powered mixer in this case because of the more complicated setup in trying to come out of the mixer to a crossover, then back in to access the power amp section.....not something a lot of folk understand and can pull off.....anyway, you only need an input for music and one mic, right?

10/4 on powered mixer. Yup, 2 inputs should be good. There is a small closet by the stage, I was thinking putting the amp and DriveRack in there to keep hands off and only have the mixer out on a small shelf or table.

What size amp will be enough to run both subs and tops? XTi 1002 or smaller?

Thanks

Would an EP2500 be over kill?

y2kindyz wrote:

Bruce Weldy wrote:

y2kindyz wrote:

I'd stay away from a powered mixer in this case because of the more complicated setup in trying to come out of the mixer to a crossover, then back in to access the power amp section.....not something a lot of folk understand and can pull off.....anyway, you only need an input for music and one mic, right?

10/4 on powered mixer. Yup, 2 inputs should be good. There is a small closet by the stage, I was thinking putting the amp and DriveRack in there to keep hands off and only have the mixer out on a small shelf or table.

What size amp will be enough to run both subs and tops? XTi 1002 or smaller?

Thanks

Instead of the XTi, I'd go with the XLS....the XLS1502 is cheaper than the XTi1002...and you get more power. I have several of the XLS amps and they work great.

y2kindyz wrote:Would an EP2500 be over kill?

If you have it, use it. For this kind of situation - it should be fine if you already have it or can get one really cheap...like $100 or less.

y2kindyz wrote:The studio is about 25 x 40 with an extra room in the back of 15 x 10 that has an opening of 6 x 6. Ceilings are about 10"

I'm guessing that all measurements are in feet?

For a 25' x 40' room, honestly, the right way to do it is a pair of SLA Pro and a T39, or 2, would be PLENTY! Mount the SLA in the 40' wall corners, toe-in to cover the room. 1 T39 in the same corners. Run it all off a single, 2-channel amp, like the EP2500. I would also recommend you get a mixer with at least 2 mic inputs, 4 preferred, and 2 line inputs. Stay away from the Behringer stuff for this. I'm personally not fond of the Mackie mixers in this small format. Yamaha and Peavey mixers are good, A&H still rules with the Zed-6. Same $$ as the Yamaha and Mackie, but WAY better mic pre, which will be important for Zumba instructors. Set them up with decent-quality wireless headsets, and they won't have to worry again. FTR, I recall another forum member, a few years ago, who's wife needed a set-up for Zumba and an outdoor Zumba parade float. All I recall is he used T39s, but I don't recall what he used for tops <pun intended>!

I'll add that an amp with DSP could be used instead of the driverack. Very simple and you can lock the settings so nobody can change them.

CoronaOperator wrote:I'll add that an amp with DSP could be used instead of the driverack. Very simple and you can lock the settings so nobody can change them.

While normally I would agree, we don't know what the second "zone' will be used for. Using an outboard DSP keeps options available. Ducking for the mics would be a nice feature.

Oscar, just how much are they will to spend to get it right?

Check out these Yamaha mixers for that use:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/AG03
h[url]ttps://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/AG06[/url]



No ducking but high pass, compression, and reverb for the mic input

USB, 1/8", RCA, and 1/4" inputs for sound

Should cover just about anything they bring in for a source.

Add one or two of these amps as needed https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/NU3000DSP some tops and subs and that would be about as cheap and simple a system as you can get.

DJPhatman wrote:

CoronaOperator wrote:I'll add that an amp with DSP could be used instead of the driverack. Very simple and you can lock the settings so nobody can change them.

While normally I would agree, we don't know what the second "zone' will be used for. Using an outboard DSP keeps options available. Ducking for the mics would be a nice feature.

Oscar, just how much are they will to spend to get it right?

Hey guys, thanks for all the advice. Unfortunately budget in on the minimal side. For starters I am going to go with the used 15" PA speakers and let her use my amp EP2500 to get the system going.

Right now she is using a single powered speaker with a Yamaha HT 8" sub.

Going to get her to purchase one of these: any recommendations as to which one?
http://www.parts-express.com/talent-mix ... r--233-121
http://www.parts-express.com/behringer- ... s--248-578
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Mix5

and the needed cables to make it all work.


Later I want her to add a DriveRack for EQ and limiting, an amp unless she wants to keep my EP2500, a Sub (T39 or T30) and probably some SLA Pro's like DJ Phatman suggested.

I should be able to run tops on one channel and subs off the other correct?

Thanks again,

y2kindyz wrote:
Going to get her to purchase one of these: any recommendations as to which one?
http://www.parts-express.com/talent-mix ... r--233-121
http://www.parts-express.com/behringer- ... s--248-578
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Mix5

and the needed cables to make it all work.


Later I want her to add a DriveRack for EQ and limiting, an amp unless she wants to keep my EP2500, a Sub (T39 or T30) and probably some SLA Pro's like DJ Phatman suggested.

I should be able to run tops on one channel and subs off the other correct?

Thanks again,

Of the three mixers - I'd throw out the Mackie ... only because it only has two band EQ. The Talent is low-end stuff, so that would go also.....that leaves the Behringer, which also leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Go on CL and look for a used Yamaha MG series or similar.....

That Yamaha ag03 mixer I mentioned ($149) has fully adjustable digital compression, high pass, and 4 band parametric EQ on the mic channel, all of which I'd say are mandatory to get pro sounding results with the microphone.



Without a high pass you would be picking up foot noise and rumble and stressing the speakers, without compression the ^plosives would be popping in your speakers and/or hurting peoples ears making the quieter parts too soft to hear, and EQ to get it to sound right.

The other mixers you listed are OK but none of them have the control that's really needed or the professional heritage of yamaha (ie: they all all known as junk brands)

y2kindyz wrote:

DJPhatman wrote:

CoronaOperator wrote:I'll add that an amp with DSP could be used instead of the driverack. Very simple and you can lock the settings so nobody can change them.

While normally I would agree, we don't know what the second "zone' will be used for. Using an outboard DSP keeps options available. Ducking for the mics would be a nice feature.

Oscar, just how much are they will to spend to get it right?

Hey guys, thanks for all the advice. Unfortunately budget in on the minimal side. For starters I am going to go with the used 15" PA speakers and let her use my amp EP2500 to get the system going.

Right now she is using a single powered speaker with a Yamaha HT 8" sub.

Going to get her to purchase one of these: any recommendations as to which one?
http://www.parts-express.com/talent-mix ... r--233-121
http://www.parts-express.com/behringer- ... s--248-578
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Mix5

and the needed cables to make it all work.


Later I want her to add a DriveRack for EQ and limiting, an amp unless she wants to keep my EP2500, a Sub (T39 or T30) and probably some SLA Pro's like DJ Phatman suggested.

I should be able to run tops on one channel and subs off the other correct?

Thanks again,

all good advice..I've done alot of these type studios and will offer some direction from what it sounds like you barely have a budget..yes top ch1 sub ch2. yes sla (and t39) are just right for intelligibility and coverage. the talent mixer or yamaha choice is not as important as an upgraded headset mic if money is the deciding factor(good sound in good sound out). the ep2500 can easily blow the 2 way 15 unless you high pass.