I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

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camrynekai
Posts: 367
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 9:59 am
Location: Burnt Hills N.Y.

Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#31 Post by camrynekai »

Live sound is a tough business and sounding "ok" isn't an option.
Your so right and also so right.
I see lots of posts on here about volume, mega-bass, and bang for buck. But the truth is no one cares how cheap it is if it sounds like crap. No one cares how loud it is if it sounds like crap.
No crap sound here "give me 100amp service and ill give you a 100 amp service...bring your PA and I will bring mine...toss in 2500 of your most critical listeners outside and lets see who gets the job done effortlessly and with a clarity unmatched by MANY of the leading manufactures."
The national acts that I deal with are use to top of the line systems and I have to match those and have done so successfully.
Me too...but just what is a top of the line system???

Only draw backs to BFM designs....is lack of approved/certified flying attachment points, there is no manufacturer producing a consistent product and to really make BFM's shine does require some trickery in the processing department to get a smooth phase response. But then again these are a DIY cab.
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My herd of T48's

Cabs built
14- 24" T48's 3015LF's
6- OTop 2X12's W/Straight array's
4- OTop 12's W/melded array's
2- OTop 12's W/Straight array's
2- 29" Sla Pro's
1- Auto tuba ITW

biggerrigger
Posts: 560
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Location: ohio

Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#32 Post by biggerrigger »

I for one would like it if everyone would quit this type of activity. If you guys keep this up everyone is going to want BFM gear and then I would not have the best system around anymore. So knock it off would ya! :chainsaw:

Or you could do what I do and tell them its very expensive imported design that is custom designed and built by professionals. :mrgreen:
Built
4-25" Lab12 loaded T39's
2-DR250's Melded array
2-DR250's Flat array

Disco-inferno
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#33 Post by Disco-inferno »

the chap you're discussing is most likely a sales rep for the company he promotes. I read some of his stuff and couldn't help but laugh about his (and his friends) childish reactions and idiotic theories about BFM and other horn enclosures.
:cry:
Especially when comparing them, he gave me the idea he doesn't have a clue about what makes horns work, he barely knows the difference between a direct radiator and a horn, let alone the difference between a front, back, stepped or tapped horn and which advantages which design has! hence, his ongoing comparison of single cabs when it concerns horns :bull:

Grant Bunter
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#34 Post by Grant Bunter »

:wall:
This thread isn't a discussion about other designs.

In fact, from the outset, it's a review. That has tried to quash some of the nonsense surrounding Bill's designs.
It may be one bloke or more, in other forums etc, causing the fuss. Whatever.
Let's stay focused on the thread...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#35 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Grant Bunter wrote::wall:
This thread isn't a discussion about other designs.
+1. OT posts deleted.

Disco-inferno
Posts: 219
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Location: Tilburg, Netherlands

Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#36 Post by Disco-inferno »

Grant Bunter wrote::wall:
This thread isn't a discussion about other designs.

In fact, from the outset, it's a review. That has tried to quash some of the nonsense surrounding Bill's designs.
It may be one bloke or more, in other forums etc, causing the fuss. Whatever.
Let's stay focused on the thread...
sorry grant, didn't mean to offend you!

by the way Bob, I think you've got the perfect opportunity to silence the critics ......





Your opening night :lol: shame I can't be there, I would have loved to hear the fruits of your hard work!

Grant Bunter
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#37 Post by Grant Bunter »

Disco-inferno wrote: sorry grant, didn't mean to offend you!
No probs at all mate! :)
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

byacey
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Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada

Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#38 Post by byacey »

Unfortunately, (or fortunately, depending on your point of view) the majority of critics tend to spout off regarding things that they don't have any direct hands-on experience with. They may have heard a particular system in the hands of an amateur who knew little about what they were doing, and conclusions were drawn from that experience. This leads to jaded views that aren't necessarily accurate.

There are many fine products out there, generally costing more than an equivalent BFM rig performance wise; they all have strength and weakness of one manner or another by comparison. Knowing what these strengths and weaknesses are and how to work with them is where intelligence enters the equation.

A good friend of mine recently mixed on a rig with T48 subs. He asked me at least a couple of times if those were really only 15 inch drivers in the subs; he couldn't believe they could produce that much low end.
Built
T48s
WH8s
SX212

88h88
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#39 Post by 88h88 »

Last dude to talk shit about my setup only did so when he enquired about drivers and the tweeter setup. ...and then the 7U rack containing a mere 1kw and the typical Behringer DEQ/DCX combo.

He runs two of these stacks and tries to annihilate your eardrums with treble.

Image
(the stack is a good 8-9ft high in total)

I'm sure if he had RTA in that amazingly huge dual rack setup he uses to power these things he could get something approaching a decent noise out of them. I had some -25db earplugs in the first time I heard this setup and the treble was still far too hot. I honestly don't know how anyone made it out of that joint with their hearing intact, it was like having a severely pissed off cat in your ear canal.

So he had two of these stacks in the same joint I had two OT12s with the cheap-ass driver and a pair of Lab12 T60s @18" wide and I was hitting silly levels with no distortion, his kit was just breaking up like nobody's business. The MC called for the bass to be cranked on his kit and the dude who was sat at the amp rack all night twiddled something, heard the subs struggle and then looked scared as he turned them right down again. A dude sat there the entire night adjusting things. I rolled up, put the subs in front of the stage, RTA'd and then the only time I touched the mixing board was to turn it up a bit for the main act.

I somehow feel with this kit I have it too easy...
4xOT12s, 2xT39s@22", TTLS@18", 2xT60@18"

Jools4001
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#40 Post by Jools4001 »

88h88 wrote:Last dude to talk shit about my setup only did so when he enquired about drivers and the tweeter setup. ...and then the 7U rack containing a mere 1kw and the typical Behringer DEQ/DCX combo.

He runs two of these stacks and tries to annihilate your eardrums with treble...
A band I was in during the 90's used to run Marshall PA stacks. One of the worst PA systems I've ever used. IMHO Marshall should've stopped at guitar amps, 'cos they can't make decent bass stuff either. Pains me to say it when they're only 20 minutes away and they've bent over backwards to service or repair the guitar amps of at least 3 guys I know, often FOC. Good company but...

As far as silencing the critics, life has got in the way of my J12 Lite build...long story but my wife is disabled, which means we need to build a downstairs bedroom and wet room extension...in a conservation area....which means dealing with planning authorities...which is sucking my time like Dracula sucks on a virgin.

Anyway, all I have so far is a modest pair of W8s, so nowhere near as much to demonstrate as you guys with full subs and tops systems...however, we've had these up and running for the last 4 gigs and rehearsals in between. The band absolutely love em, they all reckon they're the best monitors they've used, and definitely the first monitors I've EVER used where I've been asked by the singer to turn him down in the mix.

Recently, a guitarist from another band, who is one of those gear snobs who judges everything by how much they cost, told us we should get some HK monitors like his (after all, they cost $1000 so they've got to be good right?), well, we tried his in rehearsal and they were good, but after 3 songs the singer asked for the W8s back.

Can't wait to get the Jacks on the go because if they punch above their weight in the way that the W8s do they should be amazing.
2 x 3012 HO Jack 12 Lites
2 x Delta Pro 8b Wedgehorn 8 Monitors
Subs? Big question mark!

Bruce Weldy
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#41 Post by Bruce Weldy »

88h88 wrote:
Image

Good Lord! What a giant piece of crap.....

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

biggerrigger
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Location: ohio

Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#42 Post by biggerrigger »

Good Lord! What a giant piece of name brand crap....
There Bruce I fixed it for ya :cowboy:
Built
4-25" Lab12 loaded T39's
2-DR250's Melded array
2-DR250's Flat array

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Radian
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#43 Post by Radian »

88h88 wrote:He runs two of these stacks and tries to annihilate your eardrums with treble.
Well, at least you can tell him he doesn't have the foggiest clue about setting up all that stuff.

He's actually got some cabs there that, if deployed correctly, wouldn't sound half-bad...but seeing as how he's the one getting paid to destroy the place, we can leave that to him to figure it out.

Marshall badging on Peavey DJ speakers. :roll:
Good food, good people, good times.

4 - AT
1 - TT
1 - THT Slim
2 - SLA Pro 4x6 Alphalite

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jswingchun
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#44 Post by jswingchun »

88h88 wrote:it was like having a severely pissed off cat in your ear canal.
:loler:
Omni 10
Omni 10.5
OmniTop 12 x 4
Wedgehorn 8 x 3
XF212
T39 @ 18" x 2
T39 @ 20" x 2
T39 @ 28" x 2
Jack 110 x 5
Jack Lite 12
XF210
XF210 (Slant only, no crossfire)

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Charles Jenkinson
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Re: I wish I had the opertunity to silence the critics!

#45 Post by Charles Jenkinson »

88, you definitely have a way with words, :-)

It is staggering to see rafts of DJ's, with pride in how much legit material they've got and how much (little or a lot) they've paid for gear and then to have little idea of whether it sounds any good. Me, I just had a hunch what I'd previously heard, PA wise, was not that great, because I'd heard better hi-fi sound quality, even with relatively inexpensive home separates.

The only thing i can suggest is that folks just keep preaching the Bill Fitzmaurice gospel. As the good book says: "But how can they call on him to save them unless they believe in him? And how can they believe in him if they have never heard about him? And how can they hear about him unless someone tells them?"

Truly good news.
2xJ12L (3012HO) switchable/melded
2xT30

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