Omni 15 and Omni Sub

[bgavin]

I didn't find the OmniTB15s easier to build, just different problems, especially the midrange horn.

This was my experience with both O15 and OT212.

That said, I would definitely build more O15 and O1210. I did the first O15LB and mid-horn only, for electric bass. The LB configuration is not my cup of tea, so I will do the TB instead as a cross-firing pair. I learned a lot from the mid-horn experience, and changed my build method accordingly. Ditto for OT12. It will be interesting to see if a proper Zobel network will do anything to improve response.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

It will be interesting to see if a proper Zobel network will do anything to improve response.

If anything it would probably make it worse. I optimize my crossovers to the driver impedance at the crossover frequency. The best crossovers do not use Zobels. Even Joe D'Appolito considers them a waste of parts.

[Marko Rooseno]

The O15Sub would probably not work well as a stand-alone unit for bass guitar. WB's measurement shows that the O15Sub falls like a stone after 800hz.
I'd suggest that you start by building your O10.5, then build an O15TBsub to supplement it, if you need it. With your limited woodworking skills, both of these designs make sense.

Thanks for the suggestion Mikey, no it won't be a standalone unit, this will be an addition if I feel the need for an extra low end and an ego boost. LOL. I'll be building the top soon, parts have arrived (thanks Leland).

bass players tend to be more organised, get to the gig on or before time and end up not only carrying their own gear in but that of the drummer and the guitarist who is often late...along with the PA gear.

I can relate to that with the last 2 bands I was in - I'm one of the few organising the logistics of things, from booking rehearsals, gigs, recording sessions, etc etc, and have my gear ready to go out first. But thankfully when the day comes everyone does their bit.

From a practical standpoint, the only reasons to build this cab as a sub are if you simply can't build a Titan or if you're in a big hurry and need something ASAP.

Yes, that's me. I tried my hand at woodworking, just ask people in the neighbouring units, who by the way reckons I've ruined many a quiet peaceful weekend. I'll definitely do more of this when I get a landed property.

this whole thing is just based on a simple observation and curiosity from a long time ago, and nobody is pushing it. When the subject comes-up, I only chime-in to make sure that the gives and takes of the mod are "part of record" in the thread, so that nobody reads a thread and builds it without understanding it's limitations compared to Tubas and Titans.

Well appreciated Mikey.

[bgavin]

There might be another very good reason to build the O15 sub: it is confined to 100 Hz and lower. The charts WB posted shows a real nasty spike at 250 Hz. Yes this can be EQ'd out, but it is a non-problem if O15 is used as a sub.

In my situation of playing very cramped clubs, my T39/24/12LF and O15sub are almost the same size. Both require a top box. If the charts are accurate, O15 has a bigger bottom than my T39 and requires less EQ under 100 Hz. The downside is the required active crossover.

My band wants to experiment with using a single sub+top as the backline source. Bass, keys, guitar, e-drums all DI into this box. The geetar player thinks his 1x12 Line-6 will DI, but we can mic it if needed, and iso-box it if mandatory. This backline stack will provide a balanced central sound source for everybody on stage.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

O15 ...downside is the required active crossover.
.

For high power PA, yes, but on the backline or low power PA a 1st order passive crossover is adequate for the most part and not at all expensive. It won't give the precise control that active bi-amping will, but it will still work a whole lot better than the typical commercial *x10 on top of a 1x15 rig.

My band wants to experiment with using a single sub+top as the backline source.

Single sub, no reason why not. Single top I'm not so sure, as that makes it impossible for each player to adjust their individual volumes to taste. A system such as is used for pro-touring monitors would work, with each player able to dial in their own mix through their top, but that's not at all a simple proposition.

[bgavin]

I have a four-channel preamp to accept the DI boxes. Each player can adjust their volume level to taste. Tone is set as system-wide.
I have a power amp in place anyway, so there is zero effort in putting an active 1RU crossover in the same rack.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

I have a four-channel preamp to accept the DI boxes. Each player can adjust their volume level to taste. Tone is set as system-wide.
I have a power amp in place anyway, so there is zero effort in putting an active 1RU crossover in the same rack.

A pro-touring monitor console has separate sends for each player's monitor amp/speaker/IE and allows individual mixing of all the sources to each send, so that each player can adjust not only the overall level in their monitor but also his mix without affecting what's in everyone else's. They don't come cheap.

[gdougherty]

I have a four-channel preamp to accept the DI boxes. Each player can adjust their volume level to taste. Tone is set as system-wide.
I have a power amp in place anyway, so there is zero effort in putting an active 1RU crossover in the same rack.

A pro-touring monitor console has separate sends for each player's monitor amp/speaker/IE and allows individual mixing of all the sources to each send, so that each player can adjust not only the overall level in their monitor but also his mix without affecting what's in everyone else's. They don't come cheap.

For small bands several smaller mixers would work as well as long as you don't need too many separate monitor mixes. I worked with one group that brought in a small split snake and a mixwizard to control their own IEM setups. They rolled in a rack, plugged my mics and cables into their snake and I plugged the split into my snake back to FOH. It's still not a cheap solution, but it's not a $5K+ solution either.

[Wes Whitmore]

Bgavin, This might be what you are looking for for the DI setup:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/2 ... 8_Aux.html#
-They are showing it discontinued, but I just picked one up a month or two ago. You can find them around. They are very clean and I got mine here for $225 shipped. We use an 8 channel insert snake from our board for very easy in, custom in ear monitor mixes for up to 4 people and 8 instruments. There are a ton of ways to use this box, so you might want to check it out.

Our guitarist Di's his Line6 Vetta head, and so does a friend of ours who is in a much bigger production. He sometimes mics as well, but always DIs. He also has an acoustic pickup in his strat that needs to DI. Sounds fantastic.

Wes

[bgavin]

Thanks, but I'm set. I have two Rane 1RU boxes that do this. Both are equipped with premium Burr-Brown preamps, and handle either Line or Mic level inputs. Each channel also has a 3-band EQ if need be.

The one box will handle keys, bass, guitar, and e-drums. It produces a balanced Line-Out to my crossover and power amp. PLX-1202 is more than sufficient to handle an O15 sub and OT112, or a pair of crossfired O15TB. I'm far more inclined toward the OT112 top and an O15 sub, crossed around 100 Hz.

[Wes Whitmore]

Sounds like you only need one mix then. Well, the auxpander is the only thing I have found besides a really nice board with 4 pre-aux sends that can give 4 separate mixes. You can run monitors, or in ears. This box would have helped so many people, but not many people knew about it, and ultimately, it looks like it's discontinued. This box used to be $600 when it first came out, and hung below $250 for a couple years.
Wes