BillFitzmaurice.info

With you now.. Thanks Bruce.

commander_dan wrote:

Grant Bunter wrote:What's the application mate?

I only ask, because 300W/8ohms is 42V and that's the spec in my Jands 920's as well. If the 402 is similar, that will be 450W/4ohms, and, it turns out, that equals a limiter setting of -6dB on the DCX for a result of 35V, perfect for the budget line of speakers like the BP102...

We are beefing up his home stereo, which currently consists of 2 old wharfdale floor-standing 2 or 3 ways with crackling woofers. I figure once crossed at 100hz ish the floorstanders will sound better/go louder without breaking up (if not, we'll replace the woofers, then they will sound better). He likes to play vinyl records and is planning to start learning how to mix with vinyl on 2 turntables, although he only has 1 at present for listening duties. The T24 will be corner loaded 95% of the time, and also most of the time only be used at relatively moderate volumes. The exceptions being the odd party here and there. This is why I suggested to him to build just the one cab for now. He wanted something relatively small.

I suggested the T24 with the premium driver because of the temptation to turn up; it can go a fair bit louder with the 3010LF than the BP102. That, and it just makes sense to put the absolute best driver in something that has had so much time and effort put into it

I would replace the woofers in the Wharfdales anyway.

I know you already have the 3010lf on hand, so this next point is kinda moot, but perhaps remember it for next time.
I've never had my BP loaded T39's hit the limit light.
In other words, I have no idea how loud they can get with 35V.
Those cabs have always been loud enough. That includes a neighbour telling me she had a sore chest from chest thump after an indoors show I did last year.
Sure, you'll get an extra (ballpark) +6dB in max output from the 3010lf compared to a BP102, but it's pointless to have that capability if it isn't used.

Grant, I was looking around for an appropriate amp and it occurred to me that it might be a cheaper option for him to go with an amp that had lower output but could be bridged to get to where one would need to bring full noise with the 3010LF. I have already purchased the driver (got a cracker deal too).

If the bridged 402 is not optimum (but at $180 it's certainly well priced), could you recommend something that would be appropriate, and not cost over $AUD500?

That is a great price for that amp based on local pricing.
It couldn't hurt to buy it and see if you can limit appropriately with your own DCX and not have the limiters kicking in. If for no other reason than it's enough amp to drive 4 x Otops or DR250's as well.

What you need amp wise for the 3010lf is roughly 380W/8ohms + say 100W for a bit of headroom so the amp isn't being driven to hard.

I just found this:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SPL1000MP3-S ... 1ea3a6f86e

Have I heard of Skytec? No. But with the extra inputs, radio and MP3 player and at $90 delivered who cares lol.
That might be just the ticket for parties...

Grant Bunter wrote:I would replace the woofers in the Wharfdales anyway.

Would you replace them with genuine (if it's even still possible to get them) or have a crack at another woofer? When I re-furbed my old 3-ways I chose the BP102 and it goes great in them, but it was back when I really had no idea what I was doing; while the combo of new drivers/eminence crossovers does work, it needs a hell of a lot of EQ, and would probably make Bill and others cringe if they new the combination I used lol.

Grant Bunter wrote:I know you already have the 3010lf on hand, so this next point is kinda moot, but perhaps remember it for next time.
I've never had my BP loaded T39's hit the limit light.

Sure, you'll get an extra (ballpark) +6dB in max output from the 3010lf compared to a BP102, but it's pointless to have that capability if it isn't used.

The extra output will get used though, as he only intends on building one cab (I know, recommended to build in pairs). It won't get used often, but it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. Besides, I have hit the limits my pair of T30's (not all 6 mind you, yet ) a few times and that's with premium drivers. I (and my friend) would find it frustrating to have spent the effort and time to build speakers with budget drivers only to regret not having built them with premiums.

I have told my friend to buy the 402 amp, and if it proves too hot for the DCX limiter, I'll buy it off him to use as a backup OT12 amp.

That skytec looks too good to be true, I think I'll pass, but thanks anyway.

Thanks for all your input Grant!

commander_dan wrote:

Grant Bunter wrote:I would replace the woofers in the Wharfdales anyway.

Would you replace them with genuine (if it's even still possible to get them) or have a crack at another woofer? When I re-furbed my old 3-ways I chose the BP102 and it goes great in them, but it was back when I really had no idea what I was doing; while the combo of new drivers/eminence crossovers does work, it needs a hell of a lot of EQ, and would probably make Bill and others cringe if they new the combination I used lol.

The answer would be: it depends lol.

Seriously, it depends because you would have to know what wharfedale did when putting the cabs together initially.
If they selected, or had made, each of the components in the cabs, and a custom passive crossover as well, then it would be best to either source original woofers, or find ones that are as close as possible TS spec wise as replacements.
I doubt that is the case (because if they did, then the cabs probably would have cost a lot more).

Years ago I replaced all the components in my Marantz three way cabs.
At that time, Jaycar had a much broader selection of (Response branded) components.
I spent ages reading all the specs in order to try and ascertain what would work with what, in combination with new crossovers also from response.
It turned out to work fantastically, much better than the original driver set up, but knowing what I know now, that was a sheer fluke...

If it turns out there are some "proper" crossovers in the wharfedale cabs, you could reverse engineer the components on those crossovers to at least get some idea of cross points and degree and type of slope, and then make some educated guesses about appropriate replacement woofers...