BillFitzmaurice.info

Kudos to you,
I like this thread...

I test fired two of the cabinets this weekend. I set the limiters so the amp never pushed past 34 volts with full amp gain and all other mixer/source setting to full. I did this while running a 60 Hz test tone. Not too difficult.

Its going to be awhile until I iron all the bugs out. I see the Threshold limiter is hitting almost all the time and the sound did not seem too ridiculously loud. I dropped one cabinet and the other got louder, so I fixed the phase issue. That was better.

I never get the signal input meter on the DBXPA+ to get above 1/2 way on the scale. I will take a look tonight at the +4/-10 input setting.

A few more adjustments and I will have the system into to running order.

I do have to add the initial tests were a success on some level. The system has been vetted to a degree where friendly Police Officer asked that the system be turned down. I politely obliged, but I did laugh when the Officer recommended I move "my house stereo" to the basement. I don't think it would have been worth anything to explain the nature of the cabinets, nor the fact that I will have two more bass cabs online in a few days... I did not get a ticket.

Ohh yeah, Here is the obligatory picture of a Tuba with a bunch of heavy crap on it while the adhesive sets...

Tweaked some settings and now things are beginning to sound good. Now that I have set my Jack 15's loose and crossed over at the bottom end around 220 Hz, they scream. It is impressive.

Okay, so I have a question. What would be a better option, an XLS 2500 running all four Tubas or 2 XLS 2000's daisy chained? Cost is an issue, if I don't need two amps for the subs, I don't want to spend the money... but would they starve on a 2500?

Traijin wrote:Tweaked some settings and now things are beginning to sound good. Now that I have set my Jack 15's loose and crossed over at the bottom end around 220 Hz, they scream. It is impressive.

Okay, so I have a question. What would be a better option, an XLS 2500 running all four Tubas or 2 XLS 2000's daisy chained? Cost is an issue, if I don't need two amps for the subs, I don't want to spend the money... but would they starve on a 2500?

At 35 volts max according to the plans for the Delta, that's only 153 watts each. The 2500 will be plenty to run those with two a side.

Thanks Bruce.

I have the two remaining drivers mounted up and 1 side glued up. Just need to attach the side on the other cab, solder up the speakons, trim out the mouth braces and flush cut the edges of the 2 remaining cabs. I will be testing all four cabs this weekend.

last weekend I spent about $100.00 on speakon cables for the first two cabs, XLR patches for the DBX PA+ and XLR to RCA cables. Today I spent another $100.00 on the Speakon ends and cable for the cab to cab daisy chains, an RTA mic, XLR mic line, and a mic stand. I still want an RCA to XLR transformer that balances the signal. In a previous thread I was shown a box that does this for about $50.00. Then I will close out by picking up a Crown XLS2500. After all that I will continue to do what I do every night... Try to take over the world.

My purpose in stating as much is to illustrate the incidental costs that can be incurred when putting a kit together.

Traijin wrote: My purpose in stating as much is to illustrate the incidental costs that can be incurred when putting a kit together.

We already know it lol, but it would be a very good day if we could walk out the door with the same gear for that money here is Oz...

220hz is way too high for crossing over. What else have you ignored? Got the right highpass I hope.

Traijin wrote: My purpose in stating as much is to illustrate the incidental costs that can be incurred when putting a kit together.

Spent $50 on a good Weller soldering station, then make ALL of your cables. You'll save way more than the cost of the soldering station. Not to mention, you can have much better cables with Neutrik connectors instead of that crap that comes on most cables.

Grant Bunter wrote:

Traijin wrote: My purpose in stating as much is to illustrate the incidental costs that can be incurred when putting a kit together.

We already know it lol, but it would be a very good day if we could walk out the door with the same gear for that money here is Oz...

I hear ya, Many people here are aware of exactly what is needed, but there are likely many people browsing who are just learning about what goes into the system.

Gregory East wrote:220hz is way too high for crossing over. What else have you ignored? Got the right highpass I hope.

I Haven't ignored anything. I have followed the plans. Per plan the high pass is currently at 35 Hz and will be dropped to 30 Hz when I bring the other two cabs online. The plans don't have much to say about Crossover points. The SPL charts run out to 200 Hz, after that, the discussions on the forum have been more about adjusting crossover point to sound the best. A lower Crossover point may very well work far better. None the less, your commentary is presumptuous and acidic. I can tell you, I will be ignoring any of your future comments due to the lack of constructive usefulness. Feel free to stay out of the threads I have created.

Bruce Weldy wrote:

Traijin wrote: My purpose in stating as much is to illustrate the incidental costs that can be incurred when putting a kit together.

Spent $50 on a good Weller soldering station, then make ALL of your cables. You'll save way more than the cost of the soldering station. Not to mention, you can have much better cables with Neutrik connectors instead of that crap that comes on most cables.

Yeah that's good advice, I bought a Weller station about a year ago when I soldered up my SLA's. I did buy separate cables and connectors for this project. I have found that even though I don't need four poles, I like the Neutrik NL4FX http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdet ... er=092-190 connectors better than NL2FC http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdet ... er=092-058 connector. The plastic backer is more substantial.

I got the last side panel placed yesterday and flush cut cab 3. Flush cut cab 4, set the mouth braces and place the access cover is all that remain of assembly. The I can test fire. There should be some rumbling on Sunday.

Hey man...are you gonna finish them with Duratex?..that stuff is beautiful. I just put it on my four T30's. One gallon is probably enough for four. I had just plain flat black on my 18's for a year and it was a dust magnet. The Duratex is so worth the price and looks completely pro. I guess I should post some pics on my build thread. I think a quad with those drivers will do you just fine. I don't have to push mine too hard at all to get what I've needed, especially when all four are running.

Traijin wrote:

Gregory East wrote:220hz is way too high for crossing over. What else have you ignored? Got the right highpass I hope.

I Haven't ignored anything. I have followed the plans. Per plan the high pass is currently at 35 Hz and will be dropped to 30 Hz when I bring the other two cabs online. The plans don't have much to say about Crossover points. The SPL charts run out to 200 Hz, after that, the discussions on the forum have been more about adjusting crossover point to sound the best. A lower Crossover point may very well work far better. None the less, your commentary is presumptuous and acidic. I can tell you, I will be ignoring any of your future comments due to the lack of constructive usefulness. Feel free to stay out of the threads I have created.

True, it's not immediately obvious to pro sound newbies from anywhere in these forums or in my T39 plans that you low pass subs at 100 to 120 Hz or so. Since you started out with full range cabs for tops, you wouldn't necessarily have gotten that from those plans either. So you could hardly be blamed for not knowing this (which should probably be in a sticky someplace).

But for the record, 100Hz or so is the threshold at which human hearing can tell which direction sound is coming from. So we cross over subs thereabout to keep bad things from happening, like having vocals emanate from subs.

It's such common knowledge that even pro sound guys that do everything else wrong generally get this right. Given that, it's hard to blame Mr. East for pointing this out. True that it was a bit abrupt, but I think his heart is in the right place.

doncolga wrote:Hey man...are you gonna finish them with Duratex?..that stuff is beautiful. I just put it on my four T30's. One gallon is probably enough for four. I had just plain flat black on my 18's for a year and it was a dust magnet. The Duratex is so worth the price and looks completely pro. I guess I should post some pics on my build thread. I think a quad with those drivers will do you just fine. I don't have to push mine too hard at all to get what I've needed, especially when all four are running.

Hey Don, Yup... definitely duratex. I used it to finish up my Jack 15's. You are dead on. Its a professional looking finish and its easy to apply. I currently have two gallons ready to go. I need to touch up my Jacks too. I am looking into changing from straight array into a melded and it will rough up some of the finish. I have only applied it using the duratex rollers, but the texture is as forgiving as it gets. I am expecting a full weekend of sanding, filling, rounding over etc. then another sunny day for the actually painting. I have a flat black spray paint in the mouth and visible leg of the horn.

I actually have the Jacks set up as my stereo speakers with rubber grid drawer protector mats on top of the cabinets and a coffin with twin Technic SL-1200 MK2's and a mixer sitting on top of the cabs. The weight of the box and gear has imprinted the grid format from the mats into the duratex. I am going to reapply and let it cure out for a full seven days before putting the weight on them. Last time I think I only waited 3 days.

I am also toying with some ideas for the V plate. I am considering running a line of cold rolled flat stock along the inside of the horn mouth where the v plate will bolt down too. I'll weld some nuts to the stock to act as bosses for the v plate bolts. Then I'll route out an edge and put some bridging angle (about 3/32") inlayed on the plate. This will allow the pinch force to be distributed, the edges protected and have more robust threads than a hurricane nut can offer. It will cost me about 4 pounds in added weight between the two plate edges and two cabinet edges. It will give me a chance to use the Tig Welder and Plasma cutter that has been begging to used in some fashion on this project.

el_ingeniero wrote:

Traijin wrote:

Gregory East wrote:220hz is way too high for crossing over. What else have you ignored? Got the right highpass I hope.

I Haven't ignored anything. I have followed the plans. Per plan the high pass is currently at 35 Hz and will be dropped to 30 Hz when I bring the other two cabs online. The plans don't have much to say about Crossover points. The SPL charts run out to 200 Hz, after that, the discussions on the forum have been more about adjusting crossover point to sound the best. A lower Crossover point may very well work far better. None the less, your commentary is presumptuous and acidic. I can tell you, I will be ignoring any of your future comments due to the lack of constructive usefulness. Feel free to stay out of the threads I have created.

True, it's not immediately obvious to pro sound newbies from anywhere in these forums or in my T39 plans that you low pass subs at 100 to 120 Hz or so. Since you started out with full range cabs for tops, you wouldn't necessarily have gotten that from those plans either. So you could hardly be blamed for not knowing this (which should probably be in a sticky someplace).

But for the record, 100Hz or so is the threshold at which human hearing can tell which direction sound is coming from. So we cross over subs thereabout to keep bad things from happening, like having vocals emanate from subs.

It's such common knowledge that even pro sound guys that do everything else wrong generally get this right. Given that, it's hard to blame Mr. East for pointing this out. True that it was a bit abrupt, but I think his heart is in the right place.

I appreciate the explanation and it makes perfect sense. Thanks.

Glad I'm not a pro-sound guy, just a dude making a wicked wound system for personal amusement.

What music were you playing when testing?
I'd expect the T30s to sound honky and wonky in the low/mids (ie 200hz). The Jack 15s will crossover fairly low too, so definitely be prepared for fiddling around with that a bit.
Look out, it's a roller coaster of a learning curve

bitSmasher wrote:What music were you playing when testing?
I'd expect the T30s to sound honky and wonky in the low/mids (ie 200hz). The Jack 15s will crossover fairly low too, so definitely be prepared for fiddling around with that a bit.
Look out, it's a roller coaster of a learning curve

Good point. Given the Jack 15s low extension, I'd cross over even lower than 100 Hz. Try 80.