Doing without limiting, what's the dealio?

[Gregory East]

I'm assuming I can limit what comes out of the mixer by studious observation of what goes into it before I turn up any output faders. Also assuming 1.4V will come out of the mixer when it says 0dB on the meter. Easy enough to test. Also assuming the amp isn't underated. Also testable.

The other assumption is that Behringer don't add any gain in the crossover unit ie when it says 0dB it means 0dB.

And of course assuming I can keep well intentioned helpers from turning up anything. But then if anyone fiddled with a limiter it would be a lot harder to notice than the drums slider going north. I think some tape in front of masters would be a good idea too.

BTW, allowable noise escaping venues in the CBD is less than conversation level of two people in the street, believe it or not. Things aren't too rigidly enforced but cranking subs is not an option!

[Ron K]

Greg if you haven't done so yet I would take a few minutes and look in the educational section for some links to proper gain structuring. I cannot stress how important this is for live sound usage since most people due to limited budgets and other factors simply are stuck using 1 rig for everything.

There's a lot to be said for knowing exactly how much you can hit your rig with and good gain structure throughout the system is the key to getting started and insuring that signals are kept clean.

Just yesterday I dealt yet again with exactly that issue since I had to use someones Else's rig! It never ceases to amaze me how guys who do this for money ignore the simplest of essentials in audio.
Good luck with your project.

[Greg Plouvier]

+1 for gain structure. -1 for assuming

[bgavin]

50W apiece, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to make of that. I know you like to run things cool. What's the rest of the story? Top to sub ratio low as well I presume? Or the nastiest thing in the subs was a bohdran?

I was able to meet my outdoor SPL objectives.
The requirement was 100 at the dance floor, 95 at FOH and 80s much farther back at the bar and seating.
Four T39 up front, and two DR200 per side.
Loafing.

That event was 70% canned music, and 30% live music.
Plenty of deep bass and thump.
I did have to turn up some for the headliner.

[CafSentryGnome]

BTW, allowable noise escaping venues in the CBD is less than conversation level of two people in the street, believe it or not. Things aren't too rigidly enforced but cranking subs is not an option!

a pet hate of mine is people that move in next to a pub and then complain about the noise, really if you are that concerned about too much noise you should of researched it before moving there. pub = noise

[Gregory East]

Reading Sydney's links on gain structure. The maths goes a bit over my head but it's not new to me. I get to "the doing it for real" section and sure enough:

Use the biggest signal you can at each stage to keep noise to a minimum and the widest dynamic range. I learned that from the instructions with my mixer.

so yeah, gain structure under control minus a proper limiter. At least the crossover has some kind of built in limiting, dunno what it will do in the heat of a gig but I'll test it all out.

BTW Which are louder, the jacks or the t39 wall loaded, no v plating?

BTW, allowable noise escaping venues in the CBD is less than conversation level of two people in the street, believe it or not. Things aren't too rigidly enforced but cranking subs is not an option!

a pet hate of mine is people that move in next to a pub and then complain about the noise, really if you are that concerned about too much noise you should of researched it before moving there. pub = noise

Here they build little 5 star boutique hotels next to bars and complain about the live music in the beer garden that has been going on since beer was invented. Makes my blood boil.

[bgavin]

a pet hate of mine is people that move in next to a pub and then complain about the noise,

My pet hate is a cheap motel where you find out the movie in Room 10 is the couple in Room 11...


As to venue noise, it pays to do your own leg work to avoid noise tickets.
I did a cancer benefit last year, and ignored my own gut feeling to turn down... the local gendarmes showed up in the wee hours with complaints from unhappy neighbors (a mile away). Four DR200, Four T39.

[DaveK]

I did a cancer benefit last year, and ignored my own gut feeling to turn down... the local gendarmes showed up in the wee hours with complaints from unhappy neighbors (a mile away). Four DR200, Four T39.

Boy am I glad they didn't confiscate the offending equipment

[bgavin]