bass standalone cabs

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frances-rhodes
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bass standalone cabs

#1 Post by frances-rhodes »

Hello all
First time posting here after browsing a lot through the list of DIY designs and I have some questions.
Right now I play a precision bass, maple neck (not a ton of low end), peavey musician 400 into a bassman pyramid 412, both not mine that I need to replace at some point.
I'm building the preamp section of the mesa boogie bass 400 and bought a crown 460CSL power amp and now I need to choose a cab or several cabs.
I'm looking for something rather tall to be able to hear myself correctly without being too loud and without having to EQ my sound in a crazy way while I stand up close to the speaker, and not having to raise the cab up as lots of small venues don't have anything but a chair to put amps on, which would be a catastrophe waiting to happen. So I'm looking for something rather tall when put on the floor.
I also would like something "modular", like several cabs to be stacked, as one sole big cabinet will be heavy and will need a big truck to be moved.
So my first guess was three 210 ported cabs or two 310s so I can easily move them and adapt my setup for each stage and venue, and people keep mentioning the OMNI and JACK cabs so I looked through all these (and the simplexx ones).
The OMNI15 tall boy looks not too wide and reasonably high, but I can't split it in half so I'll have to pass this one.
My second idea is: build two JACK112 as I've seen people stacking them, but even stacked, they seem a bit small.
So: two OMNI12 full range as they're a tad bigger than the JACKs.
But my question is: can I stack two of them, and how?
Two O12 cabs will be 24" wide and 56" tall, which is a bit much, but could I rotate them a quarter turn and stack them that way, resulting in a 28" wide and 48" tall stack? Should I put them head to tail or absolutely not?
And, could an OMNI12 cab be tilted back like a 112 simplexx?
Cheers
François

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#2 Post by frances-rhodes »

Here are the ideas I have.
I didn't mention that #2 proposal could have one cab mirrored so the horns can be closer or further from one another.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/13OtUnn ... sp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/13OtUnn ... xwS20/view
Image
Last edited by frances-rhodes on Sat Dec 02, 2023 8:23 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#3 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

I use a single JackLite 12, with a tilt back stand. It's all I need for indoor gigs. If your Bassman pyramid has the original drivers it would blow it away big time. You don't have any low end because that cab isn't capable of low end.

The pyramid wasn't the worst cab I ever played through, though, that would have been my '65 Bassman 2x12. :cussing: But I have to thank Leo Fender for producing such a piece of crap, it's what led me to learn how to design and build my own. :hyper:

The easiest option would be a pair of Simplexx 210. Unless you play stadiums with no PA support you'll never need anything more.

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#4 Post by frances-rhodes »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 2:02 pm I use a single JackLite 12, with a tilt back stand. It's all I need for indoor gigs. If your Bassman pyramid has the original drivers it would blow it away big time. You don't have any low end because that cab isn't capable of low end.

The pyramid wasn't the worst cab I ever played through, though, that would have been my '65 Bassman 2x12. :cussing: But I have to thank Leo Fender for producing such a piece of crap, it's what led me to learn how to design and build my own. :hyper:

The easiest option would be a pair of Simplexx 210. Unless you play stadiums with no PA support you'll never need anything more.
Hello Bill
Thanks a lot for the advice!
I was thinking of buying 3 or 4 plans including some simplexx ones, so great!
Could you please tell me what size a simplexx 210 is? is it roughly twice bigger than a 110, so 18" x 33" x 14"?
I'm not especially looking for the "easiest option" here, I really like building stuff, I have built several small 2-way PA speakers and a couple of cabs so the idea of a more elaborate design really interests me! That's why I was thinking of the OMNI12.

But, out of curiosity, is any of the 3 sketches for stacks I drew doable?
I read on the forum that you could stack two different cabs vertically like a full range and a sub with a crossover filter, so this is different, and these are not the usual front loaded cabinets so I was wondering what would happen if two of them were put on top of each other or next to each other.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#5 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Your sketches aren't visible. O12 and O15 are possibilities, but you'd probably only need one. If you did stack them the top cab would be placed upside down.

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#6 Post by frances-rhodes »

Sorry about that, the file was set to private, I changed it to public so now it should be visible by everyone!

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#7 Post by frances-rhodes »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 7:47 am O12 and O15 are possibilities, but you'd probably only need one. If you did stack them the top cab would be placed upside down.
OK, so if I understand the basic rule, when stacking or pairing two identical enclosures, "tweeters" need to be as close as possible from one another to avoid comb effects, is that right?

Rich4349
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#8 Post by Rich4349 »

frances-rhodes wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 5:48 am
I was thinking of buying 3 or 4 plans including some simplexx ones, so great!
I highly recommend just spending a bit more for the whole CD of plans. Once you build one design you'll be convinced. It's VERY well worth the small additional price.
2 DR250s, 2 27" Lab15 T-60s, 2 30" Neo Titan 39s, 1 Autotuba...and looking for more!

Bruce Weldy
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#9 Post by Bruce Weldy »

My questions are:
1. Do you have PA support at your shows? (are you running through the PA out front)
2. If not, how big are the venues you are playing in?
3. What type of music are you playing?

From what I've read, you want something that you can hear well, but not real loud. You want it tall, but not on a stand. You want it modular, but tall enough to hear.

You also are planning to use a 30 pound 2 channel amp that's not particulaly powerful. It just seems that what you have and what you want is kinda' all over the place. I get it - it's hard when offered so many possibilities and options, along with a bunch of opinions.

So, go back to my original questions.....let's start over from there. Otherwise, I can see you choosing a wholly inadequate solution. Either, not what you want as far as hearing yourself or way, way too big for the amout of volume that you actually need.

From what I've read so far, I'm tempted to suggest a T48 with and OTop12 on top. You'd damned sure hear that well....but, I have a feeling it would be overkill.....and stupid big and heavy for a bass rig.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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Tom Smit
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#10 Post by Tom Smit »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 11:58 am
From what I've read so far, I'm tempted to suggest a T48 with and OTop12 on top. You'd damned sure hear that well....but, I have a feeling it would be overkill.....and stupid big and heavy for a bass rig.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Rich4349 wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 9:23 am
frances-rhodes wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 5:48 am
I was thinking of buying 3 or 4 plans including some simplexx ones, so great!
I highly recommend just spending a bit more for the whole CD of plans. Once you build one design you'll be convinced. It's VERY well worth the small additional price.
+1
TomS

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Tom Smit
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#11 Post by Tom Smit »

@frances-rhodes
Welcome to the forum!
TomS

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#12 Post by frances-rhodes »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 11:58 am My questions are:
1. Do you have PA support at your shows? (are you running through the PA out front)
2. If not, how big are the venues you are playing in?
3. What type of music are you playing?

From what I've read, you want something that you can hear well, but not real loud. You want it tall, but not on a stand. You want it modular, but tall enough to hear.

You also are planning to use a 30 pound 2 channel amp that's not particulaly powerful. It just seems that what you have and what you want is kinda' all over the place. I get it - it's hard when offered so many possibilities and options, along with a bunch of opinions.

So, go back to my original questions.....let's start over from there. Otherwise, I can see you choosing a wholly inadequate solution. Either, not what you want as far as hearing yourself or way, way too big for the amout of volume that you actually need.

From what I've read so far, I'm tempted to suggest a T48 with and OTop12 on top. You'd damned sure hear that well....but, I have a feeling it would be overkill.....and stupid big and heavy for a bass rig.
Hello Bruce

So, to answer your questions:
There is rarely a PA support where we play with this band and the stages are often rather small, and we often rent a small truck to move our gear.
We play grunge-ish rock (the guitar player plays a cranked AC30CC2 that he likes and we all hate... but anyways, different subject, he plays loud, that is)

I think I may haven't been really clear in my original post (I'm not an English speaker so that's sometimes hard for me! I'll try again.)
I want (would like...) something that allows me to hear myself, not in terms of volume, but in terms of "clarity", as last time we played, the other band lent us the bass amp (recent mark bass head and what looked like a 115 ampeg cab, it was wider than high) and the only thing I could hear was the ooooompf, so I had to EQ all the bass frequencies out to hear myself as the cab could not be put on anything and i stood 3 feet away from it, so my sound was "weird" (and most places don't have cases to raise bass cabs, and I believe they don't sound good when not put on the floor, all the bass is lost, and a chair or a table is too dangerous).
So I'm looking for a tall amp (man sized, more or less the size of the bassman) to hear myself without the weird EQ or a crazy volume, but to ease the moving a bit I'd like my amp to be several smaller elements, like my first idea was three 210s front loaded (as I heard that's how the 810 ampeg cabs are built, four closed 210s stacked on top of eachother in one huge box) so I can put them in a smaller truck, so I can also adapt what I'll be using to the size of the "venue" (like I wouldn't bring an 810 to a bar) so take one or two cabs only when nothing bigger is needed.

The amp I have and will be using is a crown 460CSL, I think it puts out about 800W into 8 Ohms bridged (so 2 x 400W i guess), won't it be powerful enough? Or were you talking about the peavey musician 400 I mentioned?

The tuba48 is even bigger than the OMNI15 tall boy, which is already too big as one to be moved, that's why I was thinking of an OMNI12 (looks is has enough lows to not need an extra sub) that I could tilt back when needed, with legs (like the twin reverb) or something for smaller stages, and if I need a taller amp, stack two of them (the crown has 2 channels) cause two smaller cabs will be easier to move than a bigger one.

So two OMNI12s (or two JACK12s) is my idea for a tall and modular setup.
Last edited by frances-rhodes on Sun Dec 03, 2023 7:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#13 Post by frances-rhodes »

Tom Smit wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 10:36 pm @frances-rhodes
Welcome to the forum!
Thanks! :)

9830Lark
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#14 Post by 9830Lark »

I thought I was having Deja-Vu all over again...

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/bass-cab-talk.1629989/

frances-rhodes
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Re: bass standalone cabs

#15 Post by frances-rhodes »

9830Lark wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 7:59 am I thought I was having Deja-Vu all over again...

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/bass-cab-talk.1629989/
busted
But it's not the same post exactly, some progress have been made! ;)

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