What's to chat about?

[Ken Lustgarten]

I have a feeling that when the COVID restrictions start to lift, there will be a demand for live entertainment systems. Wanna be ready to capitalize on that if/when it becomes a reality.

I have been having the same feeling. Now is the time to build and be ready! I have a few projects to finish and then 4 T30's loaded with 3012LF's are on the table. In addition to that I still have a pair of DR200's to finish. They are 90% done, when finished it would put me at 6. May also build a pair of T30 slims with the BP102's from my last pair of T39's. Also need to start on some wedgehorns.

[Seth]

Prospective bass player starts taking lessons.
First lesson, learns the first note.
Second lesson, learns the tonic and the dominant.
Doesn't show up to the third lesson. Why not?
They've got a gig.

Yep, that's the old joke. And as much as I like giving bass players grief - they can make or break a band. A good bass player makes the band sound good.....a great bass player makes the band play good.


I've had the good fortune to play with a few good bass players over the years, but Earl was special - you didn't realize how good he was until you went back and listened to the performance. I wrote and recorded this tribute to him. Was able to play it for him the weekend before he died.

https://soundcloud.com/bruceweldy/earls-gone

Bruce,
I enjoyed the story and song. And am touched by the sentiment.

Thanks for sharing that with me/us. That's special.

[Seth]

What about you guys? Any plans, relative to what we do around here, for the new year?

I miss having a horn loaded sub in the living room. I might build a TTLS to fix that. I already have a T18 but the cube shape doesn't fit. TTLS can be tucked away vertically in a corner. And it goes quite a bit lower, should be nice for movies. Painted in just about the same color as the walls I think that should be the path of least resistance past the war office.

Sounds like a great plan Anton. I look forward to hearing about how it all goes.

[Seth]

I have a feeling that when the COVID restrictions start to lift, there will be a demand for live entertainment systems. Wanna be ready to capitalize on that if/when it becomes a reality.

I have been having the same feeling. Now is the time to build and be ready! I have a few projects to finish and then 4 T30's loaded with 3012LF's are on the table. In addition to that I still have a pair of DR200's to finish. They are 90% done, when finished it would put me at 6. May also build a pair of T30 slims with the BP102's from my last pair of T39's. Also need to start on some wedgehorns.

Looks like we'll have some good reading this year. I look forward to hearing about your builds as they progress Ken

Once done with my planned builds, I'll have 4x ultralight DR200's, 4x 30" T39's, and 2 WH6's. I'll likely build another pair of WH6's too, so I'll at least have enough for a four piece band.

[Tom Smit]

Seth, I'll respond to your uke-bass. I listened to one with rubber strings while my son played it at Long and McQuade (similar to Guitar Center). I was actually impressed with that little thing, so much so that I might get one once I have almost too much money.

Tom, do you play bass already? If so, how long have you been playing? And, how long would you say it took you to become fairly proficient?

I do, but only by reading the notes. Lets say that I have had a bass for decades but I haven't practiced much to play by ear, so, therefore, I am not proficient yet. I have been thinking, though, that I might take a an SBL course in a few months so that I could be closer to being proficient.

[Tom Smit]

I miss having a horn loaded sub in the living room. I might build a TTLS to fix that.

DO IT!!!

Painted in just about the same color as the walls I think that should be the path of least resistance past the war office.

Very true.

[Seth]

I do, but only by reading the notes. Lets say that I have had a bass for decades but I haven't practiced much to play by ear, so, therefore, I am not proficient yet. I have been thinking, though, that I might take a an SBL course in a few months so that I could be closer to being proficient.

SBL Course? Googled it... is that Scotts Bass Lessons?

So far, my bass playing journey is moving along nicely. Much quicker than I'd imagined possible. Had the E scale down in the first couple days and was playing along with songs rather quickly, although some songs had to be played at a slower than usual tempo. I'm just deep enough into it, that I can see this journey is much deeper and longer than I had originally thought. There are things I didn't know, that I didn't know, that I'd need to know. Looks like I've signed up for a lifelong learning process and I'm looking forward to all the little milestones along the way.

Anyway, I'm almost two weeks into it and I've been putting in 1-2 hours of practice a day. Last night's focus was finger control and speed. I switched between rowing up and down the E scale and plucking simple grooves using octaves and fifths, over and over and over for about 2 hours. There's soooooo much room for improvement in the speed of my mind. Good new is, I see noticeable improvements every time I practice. It's encouraging.

I'm glad my Bass Uke came with round wound strings. It's really forcing me to pay attention to my technique more than I would have otherwise. Might as well get the technique down and learn to play cleanly from the get-go.

[Tom Smit]

SBL Course? Googled it... is that Scotts Bass Lessons?

Yuppers!

<snip>
So far, <snip>

Wow, you're doing good. When you play through cabs that are revealing, you won't have the same troubles that other bass players have when they play through revealing cabs: they find they have sloppy technique.

[Seth]

Feeling a little chatty. So...

I got my printer ink in last week to print up my DR200 plans, but the weather has been too uncomfortable to go out and play. I know, I know... how bad could it possibly be in the non-mountainous areas of CA? Compared to the winters some of you endure, it's really not that bad. Been low to mid 50's (+/-12ºC) and whatever the humidity is combined with the breeze is just too cool to enjoy myself in the project space. So, that's on hold for a week or so.

Same for finishing up the Wedgehorn 6's and starting the T39's.

Speaking of T39's, I think I mentioned that I plugged (DA) my Bass Ukulele into the rehearsal PA (one 16" 3012LF T39 and one 2x6 SLA Pro) and did a little plunking around with my dad on the 12 string. I have the system EQ'd with a tilt on the bottom end with 45Hz approximately 15dB hotter than the mids/highs, similar to the following curve.

Anyway, E, F, G... on the E string was an absolute treat. Completely smooth and very visceral. We weren't cranking it by any means. Responsible volume given neighbors on the other side of an adjoining wall. And it was still so very satisfying on the bottom end of the scale. The little 10" practice amp I have doesn't recreate the experience at any volume. Just doesn't have it down low.

As of yesterday, I've only had the U-Bass for a month. My playing is progressing. Still a long long way to go to consider myself decent. But, I enjoyed plunking away with my dad, so I ran a craigslist add for people in the area to jam with. I got a few responses, and played with some guys this past weekend. The guy who contacted me had played (drums) professionally for years, but had to take a couple years leave from music to care for a family member. None of his old buddies were available to jam, so he invited me and a guitar player who he also found on CL over to play in his music studio. He said to just bring my bass and a cable, that he had a bass amp I could use. I get there and the amp he had for me to use was an Ampeg 8x10. I thought to myself, this should be a treat. And it was. However, no matter how I adjusted the EQ knobs, it just didn't give the same lusciously fat bottom end that I experienced with the T39.

It's completely out of character for me to be social with complete strangers, but I had a good time there. Definitely going to bring ear plugs next time though. He's a really loud drummer.

Anyway, I got to a point in my quest to learn Bass from YouTube videos that it was difficult to find a lesson for where I was at in my process. Seems I would learn a little from one video, then the next video I found left a gap in my training. So, I decided to go the route of a start-to-finish online beginner course and chose one called "Beginner to Badass" by Josh Fossgreen on BuzzBass.com, a 1-3 month course (depending on frequency of lesson/practice days per week you choose to do). I practice at least 5 times a week and am about 8 days into it so far. Much of the first 5-6 lessons was stuff I had picked up already in my YouTube lessons. One thing I did pick up, though, was alternate finger plucking. Kinda glad I caught that before I made a bad habit of using poor technique. Last night's lesson was a challenge for me, the bassline from Michael Jacksons "Billie Jean". Still kicking my ass. Practiced it a little more today with a metronome and had to start at 60 BPM, and over a half hour or so worked my way up to 120 BPM where I hit a brick wall. Enjoying the challenge and I look forward to looking back in a month or so to take inventory of my progress.


You guys up to anything?

[Tom Smit]

Last night's lesson was a challenge for me, the bassline from Michael Jacksons "Billie Jean". Still kicking my ass. Practiced it a little more today with a metronome and had to start at 60 BPM, and over a half hour or so worked my way up to 120 BPM where I hit a brick wall.

That's the way to do it, uh huh.

[AntonZ]

I have dug up my good old Tascam mp3 bass trainer. Battery now charged. The intention is to start playing some bass again this week. It has been a long time, the fingers might be a bit rusty.

[Seth]

I have dug up my good old Tascam mp3 bass trainer. Battery now charged. The intention is to start playing some bass again this week. It has been a long time, the fingers might be a bit rusty.

Just ordered a little mount/tripod for my phone, to take video. I'll post my progress... Show me what ya got! Play that funky music Netherlands boy!

[Seth]

Having recently been made aware of the tool to add dB to a cabs response chart, my mind has gone on a numbers binge... again. I don't know what's with my fascination with numbers, I guess they just add up (ba da bum crash)

Anyway, Even though I built it for the rehearsal space, I've used my single 16" 3012LF T39 in an outdoor live situation and it was sufficient, for the most part. If I pushed the system I could hear that I was into the limiter. So, it was at it's operational limit for that particular use/event.

I have 4 stacks of plywood already cut down to rough cut dimensions to complete four 30" wide, 3012LF, T39's. I also have two 3012LF's on hand and two more on the way. So, essentially, all I have to do is assemble them, which I plan to do along side the DR200 build.

Got slightly off track there. Point is, I started wondering how much power it would take to have a 5 foot stack of four full width T39's in a V configuration to equal the output of the single 16" cab... Specifically at 45Hz.

So, here's the estimated output of the 16" cab at the voltage limit (55v = +25.7764dB... I'll just round that to +26dB).



So, it looks like I get about 122dB max at 45Hz on the limiter with the 16" T39.

Let's see what it would take to equal that output with a four stack of fat boys.




+21 for one cab, subtract 6 for doubling of cabs to two, subtract another 6 for doubling cab count to four, gives me 9dB to be made up with amplification.

Four cabs is 4 watts. 2.83volts/1 watt each. Double that to account for the first 3dB is 8 watts. Double that again for the next 3dB is 16 watts. And double it again for the last 3dB (of 9) is 32watts total Or, only 8 watts/8 volts to each cab to match the output of the 16" cab at full tilt, 378 watts.

That's pretty amazing.



A couple notes about these calculations and estimates. I'm not taking into account that they're nominally 10 ohm cabs. I'm mathing them as 8 ohm cabs. However, the end product voltage is the same with either calculated ohm value. And the estimates don't include the response smoothing and improved extension of multiple cab coupling. It also doesn't take into account the benefit of v-plating, which should reportedly get about another 3dB sensitivity on the bottom end.

Taking v-plating into account, the numbers drop to only 16 watts total, 4 watts/5.66v per cab.

Again... I find that amazing. It really brings to light the value of small herds of cabs and building as wide as you can transport.

[AntonZ]

Just ordered a little mount/tripod for my phone, to take video. I'll post my progress... Show me what ya got! Play that funky music Netherlands boy!

I have recording gear, tripods and all, but I'm not much into uploading my admittedly limited skills. So many people out there who can do better. I believe there is one or two tracks on soundcloud where I play bass, that's about it.

[Seth]

Just ordered a little mount/tripod for my phone, to take video. I'll post my progress... Show me what ya got! Play that funky music Netherlands boy!

I have recording gear, tripods and all, but I'm not much into uploading my admittedly limited skills. So many people out there who can do better. I believe there is one or two tracks on soundcloud where I play bass, that's about it.

If you've got a link, I'd enjoy hearing it/them.

If there was a way some of us (Tom, you too) could buddy up and progress our skills somewhat interactively, I think that would be cool. For me, it's not so much showing off what I can do, like I'm somewhere near being good. But, more of documenting and demonstrating my progress. I feel proud of the progress I've made. I think anyone should be proud of progress in anything one puts time and effort into improving. If you aren't that good and you want to improve, I'd be happy to be witness to your improvements. Who knows, our individual improvements may help the other guy/s out in one way or another.

The guitar player that met up for the jam last weekend had been playing for 30+ years. He seemed to find his chords effortlessly (most of them. some he played flat), but his knowledge of music structure was lacking. There were questions he had that I had answers for, things I learned from the YouTube videos in my first week of playing. He had some skills, but not the knowledge. I had some knowledge, but not the skills. We're all at a different places in the journey. If any of you guys want to join in, especially if you're essentially a beginner in one way or another, feel free. I think it would be fun to have a little group here to progress with. As it is, it's pretty cool how we're all peppered across the planet and our mutual interests converge here. I enjoy you guys quite a bit and wouldn't mind expanding our shared commonalities.

If it's just not a thing you guys are interested in, I get it. That's fine. Sit back and enjoy watching my fumble fingers become more nimble.