Hello from Greece !

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damiangiannis
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Location: Greece - Thessaloniki

Hello from Greece !

#1 Post by damiangiannis » Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:09 pm

Hello from Greece . I am Giannis ! I'm a musician - pianist and i usually play in small venues where i carry my pa . As i see there are plenty of plans i would like to try out (not an experienced buider yet) but i think i will start with the wedgehorns 6 or 8 for my singer's monitor and a 10 for my stage piano and voice . I 'm thinking that the 8 will be a better choice (from the 6) so she can hear more clearly the piano in her auxiliary send ?But then again ...i don't know... At the moment I 'm trying to calculate a total amount of the cost but it seems i can't find any infomation about the crossovers . Should i assume that there will be infos in the plans ? Also i cannot figure out if the piezzos are a certain model or if i can find something similar in europe . I hope i 'll figure it out in the end . Thanks in advanced for all the help you already offering from reading the forum and for all the help i might get in the future :)

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Tom Smit
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Re: Hello from Greece !

#2 Post by Tom Smit » Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:32 am

Hi, and welcome to the forum!
The plans contain the information that you need.
For sources of parts in Europe, consider this link. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=4140
TomS

damiangiannis
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Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:17 am
Location: Greece - Thessaloniki

Re: Hello from Greece !

#3 Post by damiangiannis » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:31 am

Thank you Tom ! I have some questions regarding the buildings of w6,w8 and w10 . For the Wedgehorn 6 kit on Leland's site the horns are the goldwood gt-1005 piezos , which when i google it i see that is a circular tweeter ... Trying to find the europe friendly alternative here,so i can decide which one is the easiest for me to build(if not all).
If the alternative of the goldwood gt-1016 (for the wedgehorn 6) is the Monacor MT-016 then the alt for the gt-1005 would be the monacor mpt-005(also circular)?
I also see (for the w6) that some builds have the melded array in the center (8 half piezzos) and others have them in the side mouth walls of the cab (4 hole piezzos).
Are these two designs in the plans of the same project ?
As for the w10 i see on Lelands shop the kit contains a set of gt-1016s piezzos. What is the s refers to ? Is it any defferent from the gt-1016 ?
And one more ... on Bills main site on w10 there is a review of someone named David made them active [PE amp] . How can this be done ? What is [PE amp] ?

Sorry for all my noobness...Trying to learn ! Hope i 'm not irritating anyone :)

Grant Bunter
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Re: Hello from Greece !

#4 Post by Grant Bunter » Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:45 pm

Hi Damian,
Welcome to the forum :)

My older plans for the WH6 also use the goldwood 1016's. Perhaps the 1005's are an update?
Yes, both options (melded, and panel mount) are in the plans.

Generally, it's not encouraged to make any of Bill's designs active, it means more cables, more power routing, and if the amp fails, so does the monitor or cab, but it is DIY, so you can do whatever you like.
PE in this instance refers to Parts Express ( www.partsexpress.com).
You need to add a separate section or chamber to the cab to house an amp to make any cab active in Bill's designs.
Nothing can intrude into the cab or horn path without affecting performance.
Don't worry about the additional s.

The choice of which design depends on both required response and pack space. You're correct in thinking a WH10 for keys, especially for left hand in the monitors. I know Bill uses WH6's for himself, but I opted for WH8's for vocals. If you want to feed keys to your singers monitor, from 100Hz up, I would go for WH8...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 (melded array) with March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

damiangiannis
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:17 am
Location: Greece - Thessaloniki

Re: Hello from Greece !

#5 Post by damiangiannis » Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:59 pm

Grant Bunter wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:45 pm
My older plans for the WH6 also use the goldwood 1016's. Perhaps the 1005's are an update?
I know see that the s stands for plural :wall: So embarrassed ! So I'm safe with the monacors mpt-016 as the european alternative ! Am i ?
Grant Bunter wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:45 pm
Generally, it's not encouraged to make any of Bill's designs active, it means more cables, more power routing, and if the amp fails, so does the monitor or cab, but it is DIY, so you can do whatever you like.
Could i built a class -d amp diy kit (for instance 2x50w) and get away with it ?
Grant Bunter wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:45 pm
The choice of which design depends on both required response and pack space. You're correct in thinking a WH10 for keys, especially for left hand in the monitors. I know Bill uses WH6's for himself, but I opted for WH8's for vocals. If you want to feed keys to your singers monitor, from 100Hz up, I would go for WH8...
That was also my thinking but was/am very intrigued on how lightweight the w6 can be (12 pounds with 1/4'' ply!!!) . I might build all three and have a useful spare ! :D

Grant Bunter
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Re: Hello from Greece !

#6 Post by Grant Bunter » Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:00 am

damiangiannis wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:59 pm
So I'm safe with the monacors mpt-016 as the european alternative ! Am i ?

Yes.

Could i built a class -d amp diy kit (for instance 2x50w) and get away with it ?

Put the passive filter in and go for say 200W class D, if you must


I might build all three and have a useful spare ! :D

Go for it :)
Built:
DR 250: x 2 (melded array) with March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Hello from Greece !

#7 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:42 am

IMO on-board amplification isn't a very good idea, and on-board amplification of floor wedges is a particularly bad idea. With a passive speaker you have one cable on the floor, the speaker cable. With active you need a signal cable plus a power cable. If you have three cabs on the floor that's three cables versus six. With passive you can drive at least four wedges with one amp. With active you need an amp for each speaker.
Yes, there has been a massive swing away from passive speakers to active speakers in the last few years. That swing has been manufacturer driven, with the goal being profits. It's called Vertical Integration. Instead of one company selling speakers, another processors, another amps, another EQ and so forth the goal is to have you buy everything from one company. While the advertising claims that this is for your benefit it really benefits company CEOs and shareholders.

Bruce Weldy
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Re: Hello from Greece !

#8 Post by Bruce Weldy » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:14 am

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:42 am
IMO on-board amplification isn't a very good idea, and on-board amplification of floor wedges is a particularly bad idea. With a passive speaker you have one cable on the floor, the speaker cable. With active you need a signal cable plus a power cable. If you have three cabs on the floor that's three cables versus six. With passive you can drive at least four wedges with one amp. With active you need an amp for each speaker.
Yes, there has been a massive swing away from passive speakers to active speakers in the last few years. That swing has been manufacturer driven, with the goal being profits. It's called Vertical Integration. Instead of one company selling speakers, another processors, another amps, another EQ and so forth the goal is to have you buy everything from one company. While the advertising claims that this is for your benefit it really benefits company CEOs and shareholders.
Amen
Amen
Amen!

Local club owner has been quizzing me on gear for his new inside venue. Told him what I thought about powered gear, so of course - he bought all powered boxes.....mains, sub, and monitors. I don't mind mains and subs being powered in an install, but powered monitors are a PITA. Stiff, kinked-up IEC cables all over the front of the stage. And nice little knobs on the back for all the musicians to screw with. This system will be used by the bands - often with their own mixer and running it themselves....

All of this because he really didn't want to have a rack......you know, like the one he will end up putting the monitor EQs in..... geez.....

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

damiangiannis
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:17 am
Location: Greece - Thessaloniki

Re: Hello from Greece !

#9 Post by damiangiannis » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:54 pm

Happy new year to all ! I see your points ! I will not mess with the plans then... didn't plan to in the first place . My question was about if i could use a class-d 2 channel amplifier (diy if there is a kit in mind) for the wedges .I was thinking more of a racked diy kit (don't know if it even exists) and was just wondering about how much power i would need to drive the monitors . As i see it i will propably skip the class-d route as Bruce implied and go on buying a Samson Servo or something similar in the same price point.But first i have to built :) Tommorow i will ask for cutting prices and see if its better on buying a table saw on a budget :) Also i will talk to some friends if they will need any plans to finalize my decisions on how many plans i will get ...Searching continues :)

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