Car Door speaker baffles

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madmallard
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Car Door speaker baffles

#1 Post by madmallard »

Stupid question time, Are those foam cup shaped baffles for car speakers useful at all?

Other than protection from in-door weather, It seems like they'd be too deep and squish, or that puncturing them to run wire would compromise their function somehow.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#2 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Car door speakers aren't spec'd to work in a small enclosure.

CoronaOperator
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#3 Post by CoronaOperator »

madmallard wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:54 am Stupid question time, Are those foam cup shaped baffles for car speakers useful at all?

Other than protection from in-door weather, It seems like they'd be too deep and squish, or that puncturing them to run wire would compromise their function somehow.
Yes they are useful, they keep water from ruining your drivers. Pull your door card (inside door trim) off and take your car through a car wash. You would be absolutely flabergasted how much water travels through your door! The first thing to go on your nice new driver is the spider, once it gets wet it loses the accordion shape and the driver is ruined.

The point of the baffle then is not as an enclosure but as an umbrella. I usually cut the bottom 1/3 and bottom back 1/3 off of them. That way water that enters through the window seal still gets diverted around the driver but the cutouts allow the driver to use the entire door as an (leaky) enclosure. Run your wires from the bottom cutout and no worries. In this picture I would cut away everything in green:

Image

Of course if you re-use the factory water-diverter then you don't need to use the foam baffle.
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

madmallard
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:42 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#4 Post by madmallard »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:50 pm Car door speakers aren't spec'd to work in a small enclosure.
you see, thats what I always thought, that coax and car type speakers were basically an infinite baffle/free air application, right?

and that those baffles are actually airtight and become a little enclosure.
CoronaOperator wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:11 pm
The point of the baffle then is not as an enclosure but as an umbrella. I usually cut the bottom 1/3 and bottom back 1/3 off of them.
I don't ever see them used like this in most manufacturer example pics of installation.

XTC, one of the more known names thanks to ol crutchfield, says on their website:
Along with providing a sealed chamber the Acoustic Baffle forms a mounting seal between the speaker and the mounting surface, eliminating panel to frame resonance.
Now, the mechanical vibration might be mitigated by the foam lip, but speaker gasket tape does that same job, right?

And if you seal it, don't you ruin the seal when you run the wires to it anyways?

Sorry if this was a distraction/OT, but I finally got my electronics setup how I want in the car and started stress testing the car with 40hz from the sub for various panel's vibration and got real curious just staring at the door speaker.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#5 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

madmallard wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:37 pm you see, thats what I always thought, that coax and car type speakers were basically an infinite baffle/free air application, right?
Free air is no enclosure, IB is a sealed cab, usually a large one. A car door is neither, but is close to a very lossy IB.
I don't ever see them used like this in most manufacturer example pics of installation.
That would be the best way to use them, shielding the driver from water that enters the door via the gasket with the window, which is never water tight, while not being able to collect and hold water itself.
XTC, one of the more known names thanks to ol crutchfield, says on their website:
Along with providing a sealed chamber the Acoustic Baffle forms a mounting seal between the speaker and the mounting surface, eliminating panel to frame resonance.
In the words of the inestimable Paul Klipsch, "Bullshit!".

CoronaOperator
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#6 Post by CoronaOperator »

madmallard wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:37 pm XTC, one of the more known names thanks to ol crutchfield, says on their website:
Along with providing a sealed chamber the Acoustic Baffle forms a mounting seal between the speaker and the mounting surface, eliminating panel to frame resonance.
Now, the mechanical vibration might be mitigated by the foam lip, but speaker gasket tape does that same job, right?

And if you seal it, don't you ruin the seal when you run the wires to it anyways?

Sorry if this was a distraction/OT, but I finally got my electronics setup how I want in the car and started stress testing the car with 40hz from the sub for various panel's vibration and got real curious just staring at the door speaker.
I ruined a pair of CDT M6 midbass's from water damage :wall: . If you are not reusing your factory water shields, you absolutely need some kind of water mitigation for them. Those baffles are perfect for that. By not cutting the bottoms off you are really restricting the driver. Even though with a sub you don't run door speakers below 80hz, to get decent 80hz out of them you need some air behind them. You can generally model a car door as a 1 cu ft leaky box.

I'm huge into car audio, here is my initial install if you like looking as pictures : http://s769.photobucket.com/user/corona ... t=3&page=1 - those m6's quickly became water logged, I use the baffles from now on.
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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Tom Smit
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Location: Sarnia, Ont. Canada

Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#7 Post by Tom Smit »

If you look at the pictures you will note that he used damping material on the doors, which helps the lower frequencies.
CoronaOperator wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:02 pm I'm huge into car audio, here is my initial install if you like looking as pictures : http://s769.photobucket.com/user/corona ... t=3&page=1 - those m6's quickly became water logged, I use the baffles from now on.
Is that a factory supercharger?
TomS

CoronaOperator
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#8 Post by CoronaOperator »

Tom Smit wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:57 pm If you look at the pictures you will note that he used damping material on the doors, which helps the lower frequencies.

It does by adding mass but it's main purpose as a dampener is to eliminate ringing, sort of like holding a bell in your hand and hitting it as opposed to striking it while hanging. You really only need about 50% coverage in the center of panels to stop the ringing but I wanted to also seal at least the majority of the leaks.
Tom Smit wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:57 pm Is that a factory supercharger?
Yes it is, fun when I bought it but now the premium gas all the time is :broke:. If you really had a good eye you would of noticed the orange glow of the vacuum tubes on the Butler Tube Drivers:
Image
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

That system can give me the exact same experience my 4 DR250's and 2 dual T60's can do, just only for 2 people though, and it loses response pretty quick below about 35hz but has a bit better imaging and silk domes sound a little sweeter than CD's. I no longer use the kick mounted tweeters and use a-panel mounted ones only. I also don't use half of the passive x-overs anymore as digital units came out with time delay and memory for presets so I took advantage of the technology.

The car is at the end of its life cycle so everything is getting ripped out at the end of summer :cry: , It was that autotuba that got me into BFM in the first place.
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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Tom Smit
Posts: 7457
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Sarnia, Ont. Canada

Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#9 Post by Tom Smit »

CoronaOperator wrote: Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:25 am If you really had a good eye you would of noticed the orange glow of the vacuum tubes on the Butler Tube Drivers:
I have bad eyes; I need/wear glasses.
:lol:
TomS

madmallard
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:42 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#10 Post by madmallard »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:53 pm In the words of the inestimable Paul Klipsch, "Bullshit!".
as another aside.... is there any good reading on this guy that I can learn more about?

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Car Door speaker baffles

#11 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

Google is as good as any source. There is a biography that's out of print.

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