Amp - Brown Out Protection

[BassNoid]

Class D amps running on battery backup power.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j89MTFSNDPY

What do you think ? ?

[Ryan A]

It's a good concept in case someone trips over the power cord, etc.

He obviously doesn't know how Behringer claims their power ratings though. In that video he might be using a few hundred watts. That battery backup wouldn't know what to do with a 15,000 watt load.

As far as Class D amps being more/less susceptible to brownout failures I'm not sure.

[byacey]

I watched right up until he said "Two UPS power supplies, 875W of clean power, let me demonstrate this to you."

If he can pull 15,000 watts at 120V from 2 UPS units rated for perhaps 1000 watts each, he should file a patent for perpetual motion. When are people going to learn that you can't create energy from nothing?

[DJPhatman]

I watched right up until he said "Two UPS power supplies, 875W of clean power, let me demonstrate this to you."

If he can pull 15,000 watts at 120V from 2 UPS units rated for perhaps 1000 watts each, he should file a patent for perpetual motion. When are people going to learn that you can't create energy from nothing?

His reply is to take it up with Behringer! I replied to the video to measure the output voltage at the speaker connections, then tell us how many watts he is outputting.

And, FTR, my 2 Omni 10s and 2 Titan 39s would wipe the floor clean with that system. My very rough guess would be +10dB.

[BassNoid]

Watch the whole video !

Put aside the his B.S. and the urge to engage in a pissing contest and consider the main premise that he has put forward.

1. The design of the amp makes them receptive to damage from low voltage, brown out.

2. That the use of the UPS would provide protection from this type of damage.

I'm interested in your opinion and more importantly the experiences with these amps as I'm considering a purchase.

[byacey]

Most switching power supplies of any worth have low voltage shutdown; when the voltage gets down too low to operate in a reliable manner, they simply shut down. A class D amp is nothing more than an audio modulated switching power supply.

I would suggest if these particular amps are prone to catastrophe if the voltage dips lower than the recommended level, an upgrade to better quality amps is in order, and a search for a more stable power source.

[ncgrove]

search for a more stable power source.

Yep. Don't fry your gear by plugging it in at a place with unreliable mains. Go play elsewhere and let someone else fry their gear.

Ask me how I know that one...

[Ryan A]

Has anyone tested the output of those APC style battery backup units? I'm wondering how clean the waveform is. They say "simulated" sine wave but does that mean simply square wave or something a bit more accurate?

[byacey]

They use a stepped square wave, which loosely simulates the RMS value of a sine wave.

[BassNoid]

Well some of us can't be so picky. Once booked by your agent and arriving at unknown venue you are stuck.

Is it true the the iNukes flame out when face with low/poor power or does the author engage in some hyperbole ? Do they have low voltage protection ? If so how good is it ?

If iNuke do flame out or self destruct under these conditions what can done to prevent it.?

Will a UPS clean the power well enough ?

These a few questions that come to mind.

[DJPhatman]

Well some of us can't be so picky. Once booked by your agent and arriving at unknown venue you are stuck.

You have control over your booking agent, they work for you. A good booking agent uses contracts to provide "protection" to their clients (you) and the equipment. A really good booking agent is already familiar with the venue, and is knowledgeable about staging and set-up.

Will a UPS clean the power well enough ?

UPS don't "clean" the power, they provide stable power in case of brown/black-out. They buy you time to properly shut down your electronics to save them from damage.

[BassNoid]

Well regarding booking agents my considerable experience is that the protection they are most concerned about is that they get paid ! A really good agent is a is like real love hard to find and many times you are stuck with what you can get if you want to work.

As a working musician with decades of experience I know I can expect just about anything when I walk into new venue. I'm just trying to find a source of information on how to avoid problems, and solve problems when they show up.

I have a great deal of respect for opinion about the technology end of sound systems.

So the question is does this video present a workable solution or a waste of money to a problem of flaming out iNuke amps.?

[Grant Bunter]

I guess what you need to know is maximum draw power for the amp in question.
If that's not available in the manual, contact Behringer and ask them.

It will be a reasonably high figure with the 3000, so whatever you get needs to cover that figure.
As to if battery backups, uninterupted power supplies or power conditioners can cover that (at reasonable cost), well, that's a different story.

If you want to guarantee no probs at any gig, add up all your power requirements from amps, guitar amps, FX, mixers, processors, lighting etc, and buy a generator that will cover that.

I did.

edit: it draws 230W at 1/8th power with a 4 ohm load.
so 100% power @ 4 ohms load = 1840W would be what you need to cover it for.

[DJPhatman]

So the question is does this video present a workable solution or a waste of money to a problem of flaming out iNuke amps.?

Sure it works. My earlier points are that he is not getting the power he thinks he is.

And, I believe I answered your question in my last post:

UPS don't "clean" the power, they provide stable power in case of brown/black-out. They buy you time to properly shut down your electronics to save them from damage.

If there is a brown-out or power loss, the UPS gives you a limited amount of battery time to properly shut down sensitive electronics. Will it work? Yes. Will it keep the show going? No. Will it help keep you from smoking your sensitive electronics? Long enough to do a proper shutdown. Will it correct power sag from the outlet? To a small extent. If the wall outlet droops to, say, 90 Volts, the UPS takes over for as long as it's battery charge will allow it to. It will not generate power to keep playing. You need a generator for that.

[whines]

Consider a voltage regulator--they're cheaper, far lighter, and don't have batteries that need periodic replacement:

http://www.apc.com/products/family/index.cfm?id=67

(just an example, not a specific reccomendation)

Unless you actually intend to run off batteries (for the few short minutes they'd last) I'd use one of those instead.