Looking to upgrade amp/electronics.

[johns811]

I build a T24 20" and 2 sla pros for a project and to use for backyard parties. Been pretty good so far but I skimped on the AMP. I bought a plate amp at Parts express to handle the 100 htz crossover point. The other AMP is Pyle. Heavy and not greatest but it has worked good for so I'd like to keep using.
Despite far from ideal the system has performed very well for needs.

What I'd like to do is:
- Add another Tuba 24
- Replace the plate amp with a new amp (for sub, or tops or both if possible).
- Keep using Pyle for Sub or tops (unless I don't need it).
- Have sound processing (xover) capabilities.

So my questions is what kind of amp should I buy? I need sound processing capabilities also. I read some of the new amps that have all the processing, would 1 be enough to run both subs on 1 channel and both SLA pros on the other. I'd had hoped to keep running in stereo mode but open to options. My first hunch was I need a crossover and another amp but I'm not really not sure what to do. Any help appreciated.

[Michael Ewald Hansen]

I build a T24 20" and 2 sla pros for a project and to use for backyard parties. Been pretty good so far but I skimped on the AMP. I bought a plate amp at Parts express to handle the 100 htz crossover point. The other AMP is Pyle. Heavy and not greatest but it has worked good for so I'd like to keep using.
Despite far from ideal the system has performed very well for needs.

What I'd like to do is:
- Add another Tuba 24
- Replace the plate amp with a new amp (for sub, or tops or both if possible).
- Keep using Pyle for Sub or tops (unless I don't need it).
- Have sound processing (xover) capabilities.

So my questions is what kind of amp should I buy? I need sound processing capabilities also. I read some of the new amps that have all the processing, would 1 be enough to run both subs on 1 channel and both SLA pros on the other. I'd had hoped to keep running in stereo mode but open to options. My first hunch was I need a crossover and another amp but I'm not really not sure what to do. Any help appreciated.

Well, since you're using pro-subs and tops, you should get yourself an amp suitable for pro gear - you don't need huge amounts of power to drive your system, and you certainly don't need stereo anyways in my opinion.

Why not go with a XTI1002? It has all the DSP you need for crossovers and EQ and you can set limiters!

http://www.speakerhardware.com/xti-1002.php

Then you can run your 2 subs from one channel and the 2 tops from the other - perfect solution

[Grant Bunter]

Well, since you're using pro-subs and tops, you should get yourself an amp suitable for pro gear - you don't need huge amounts of power to drive your system, and you certainly don't need stereo anyways in my opinion.

Why not go with a XTI1002? It has all the DSP you need for crossovers and EQ and you can set limiters!

http://www.speakerhardware.com/xti-1002.php

Then you can run your 2 subs from one channel and the 2 tops from the other - perfect solution

+1

[SirNickity]

I wouldn't give up stereo, even for PA. Standing 25 feet from a pair of blaring tops throwing a wiiiiide stereo image is a fantastic experience. But then my musical tastes tend toward the lush side.

My opinion on amps: If it has enough power (but not too too much) and meets your needs regarding weight, convenience, and reliability, then it's fine. I do not believe pro-audio amps have any particular voodoo that makes them more suitable than any other capable amp. They're mainly advisable for connectivity options and their form-factor (i.e., rack-mount.) If you were standing next to a stack of car batteries, I'd suggest a car amp.

So, that said, what are your peeves right now?

With the plate amp, is it mounted to the box, or a standalone affair? If it's external, I would replace it with a rack-mount so you can have all your electronics together in a box that can be stacked up and out of the way when you're not using it. This convenience may or may not be worth the cost to you.

If you've already mounted it to the cab, and unmounting it would necessitate cosmetic repair, then what's your primary beef with it? If it has a suitable amount of power, you can do all your signal processing through a dedicated box, so just get another like amp for the new sub, get the Behringer DCX2496 for your crossovers and limiting, and call it a day. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a self-powered speaker if running signal + power to the cab is not out of the question. For mobile (DJ / band) use, it's more convenient to run a single Speakon cable, but with your use-case, that's probably not a deal-breaker.

The Pyle won't get you any brand-whore cred, but an amp's primary purpose is to take a small input signal and output a bigger one. If it does that, and you're OK with everything else about it, then use it until it dies, or you're given an irresistable deal on a better one.

[johns811]

Actually I mounted the plate amp inside a case. The case has the mixer mounted and since the mixer is really narrow there was plenty of room behind it so I mount the plate amp on the backside of the case and it worked out really well. I didn't know if the plate amp was up to powering another T24?

I'd really like to do this better, keep the pyle if can, nice to have a backup amp for an emergency. I was thinking another amp and signal processing but maybe with these new amps that is not necessary. That is why I'm seeking advice. I like the idea of 1 lighter amp to do the entire thing. What about the crown XLS series?

[SirNickity]

Here's your compromise:

If you get an amp with onboard DSP, that's one less thing you have to buy and carry. But, you still pay for it, it's not as comprehensive as outboard DSP, and if you ever need to exchange amps, you have to ensure the replacement has the processing you need. (This is more of an issue when your paycheck or reputation is on the line and you have to make-do with something else now.)

Personally, I would always opt for a dedicated processor for the flexibility, and having a piece of gear with exactly that purpose means it's designed to be good at that one thing. It's not just another bullet point on the feature list. Many will disagree. Entirely your call. Either way gets the job done.

Crown amps are good. So are the QSC equivalents. The Peavey IPR is often chosen for its price-to-performance and weight. People will recommend one over the other, but whether they do so because that's what they own, or they own them because that's what they recommend is questionable. Myself, I use Crown XLS (old-school Class A-B) because I prefer a linear PSU, it's what I have, and they work well. If they were entirely replaced with another brand, I'd use that instead.

It mostly comes down to price and availability, and how much you want the onboard DSP to do. For instance, some of the amps have pass-through outputs to feed another amp -- possibly even low-passing the powered output for your subs, and high-passing the line output for your mains amp. I don't remember off-hand which ones do that, so someone else will have to pipe in.

[Tom Smit]

A fellow member is selling some stuff

[johns811]

I think I have decided to build another T24, buy an active crossover and another amplifier. I can run the 2 Tuba24 off 1 amp, 2 sla off the other. I rarely do any paying jobs but if I did and an amp failed I could still function. Seem like a good plan?

[Tom Smit]

Yep. Good plan.

[SeisTres]

get the xti1000/2000 or equivalent. This will allow you to run two or three subs off one channel and tops off the other channel with all the watts and processing required. Keep it simple. For home audio, stereo is very nice; for PA, doesn't matter. Been there, done that, always kicked myself for not keeping it simple.

[BrentEvans]

For home audio, stereo is very nice; for PA, doesn't matter. Been there, done that, always kicked myself for not keeping it simple.

Have to -1 this... stereo in PA can be useful for gain before feedback, if nothing else. That's not to say that you should hard pan everything... just what needs to be panned for whatever reason. Cross-panning mics that are used on choirs, orchestras, etc, can help balance the room and get you several free db of gain on each side. By cross panning, I mean you put the left mics into the right stack and vice versa. Additionally, there are plenty of instances where you can put a large amount of the audience at least mostly in the stereo sweet spot, and you can do panning for effect.


Additionally, you have built-in backups and extras in the way of amp channels if you have to reroute something in a hurry.

[SirNickity]

For that matter, if you're running mono, why have two tops at all? Wouldn't you be better with a central stack? (Obviously for live sound, the lead vocalist may not approve of the layout... ) Having two point sources of the same content is back to the whole comb-filtering thing, isn't it?

[Bruce Weldy]

Having two point sources of the same content is back to the whole comb-filtering thing, isn't it?

Not if they are spread out....it when they are side-by-side and close that's a problem.

I would love to do a mono stack someday. Just haven't been in the right setting yet.

[SeisTres]

For that matter, if you're running mono, why have two tops at all? Wouldn't you be better with a central stack? (Obviously for live sound, the lead vocalist may not approve of the layout... ) Having two point sources of the same content is back to the whole comb-filtering thing, isn't it?

Same reason why i would sometimes split my subs - more even coverage. Also same reason why in very wide rooms you use four stacks of tops rather than two and in very long rooms you use fills for the back. And no, they won't really comb since the frequencies are big enough at those distances for tops. Splitting the tops allows you to cover the whole dance floor and room very nicely and still mantain max spl in the middle of the dance floor while keeping the lights and dj/band/event in the middle as the main show.

But yes, now that you mention it, sometimes for really small backyard parties or get-togethers, I would run a single stack of two or one t39 and two jacks, no stands. Or sometimes i would just stack two jacks in one stand, but i always preferred the single jacks in two stands for the reasons i listed above.

As it was mentioned above, it's produces a very nice effect especially for dual guitars or dual lead vox (my favorite times to use it), but most of the time it wasn't worth the extra effort for me.