BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

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Radian
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BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#1 Post by Radian » Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:14 pm

After researching DCX/DEQ IO mods, I pulled the trigger on replacement output cards from Simon Ashton for my DCX.... to test the waters.

Any sonic/audible improvement?

YES! :shock: Holy Sh*t yes. Extremely Hi-Fi. Silky smooth and a deeeeep soundstage.

Hard to install?

Not too bad, but the wiring does require some planning (especially if using the input cards too) and the use of a needle point soldering tip. Don't bother trying with a chisel tip no matter how small, nor a butane pen like I tried at first. :conf:

Worth it overall?

That depends on how much time and equipment is spent on the project...alongside the reliability of your our own handy work. The cards aren't inexpensive, but you simply can't buy a premium DBX or Ashley that sounds better than this either. Took longer to install than I had intended but, soundwise though, it's the best analog preamp I've experienced to date.

The modded DCX driving a DC-300A Series II approaches the sound quality of the NAD C390DD. That's a big deal.
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jimbo7
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#2 Post by jimbo7 » Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:52 pm

I googled "Simon Ashton" and a bunch of stuff about a computer virus came up. :shock:
BFM builds:
XF212
T24 BP102 24"
2x SLA's 6-5" mids, 9-gt-302's
2x AT 14" MCM 55-2421
TrT 5" MCM 55-2421
AT 18" JBL GTO804
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Radian
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#3 Post by Radian » Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:34 pm

News to me. Sounds like :bull:

I experienced no problems either communicating with or purchasing the upgrade cards from his business.

Try Behringer Mods and his bio listed here instead of Google.

The pic below is before I installed everything.
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DCXO.jpg
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djtrumptight
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#4 Post by djtrumptight » Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:31 pm

Do u think also doing the inputs is worthwhile ? I watched the video,thats a challenging mod,i'm thinking about doing my outputs on 1 of my DCX's.
Built:
2 Autotuba's MCM 55 2421
8 T48's 24"wide 3015 LF
2 DR 250's melded Deltalite II 2510
2 DR 250's flat Deltalite II 2510
2 SLA HT systems
1 Table Tuba Dayton DCS 255-4
2 T 39's 20" wide 3012 LF
1 T-18 13" wide MCM 55 2421
2 SLA Pro's

CoronaOperator
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#5 Post by CoronaOperator » Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:13 am

You haven't even begun to hear sound quality until you've heard my $4995 cryogenic speaker cables! I've owned 2 DCX2496's for about 11 years now and they are as clean as any other device out there. A bit of a noise floor until you ground the chassis to everything else and then invisible. Whatever you heard was in your head.

Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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BrentEvans
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#6 Post by BrentEvans » Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:38 pm

CoronaOperator wrote:
Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:13 am
You haven't even begun to hear sound quality until you've heard my $4995 cryogenic speaker cables! I've owned 2 DCX2496's for about 11 years now and they are as clean as any other device out there. A bit of a noise floor until you ground the chassis to everything else and then invisible. Whatever you heard was in your head.

DCX units may be as “clean” as other units where noise is concerned, but they’re certainly not the best sounding DSP out there. Poor circuitry before the ADC and after the DAC can add distortion. My experience with the DCX has been that, when only used for crossover duty with moderate slopes (24db or less) they generally sound OK on entry level Systems. Load up the DSP more than that or get a better system and the flaws begin to show when compared to even something like the VENU360 or Ashly Protea line, which are not terribly expensive (certainly not at the level of units from Symetrix, BSS London or Lake).

Honestly, even the built in processing on the iNukes sounds better to me than DCX. DCX is an OLD OLD OLD product. There really haven’t been any significant updates in that design for what, 15 years at least? That would be like using a Yamaha 01v, a Mackie TT24 or a DDX3216 digital console and calling it as good as a TF3, Axis, or X32. Nobody would go back to those first generation consoles, but the DCX is still popular for some reason. And, it does work... but it is what it is. It’s not a high end unit. There ARE definently mods that can make it better, but it will never be at the level of London or Lake.
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Radian
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#7 Post by Radian » Mon Mar 19, 2018 8:58 pm

djtrumptight wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:31 pm
Do u think also doing the inputs is worthwhile ? I watched the video,thats a challenging mod,i'm thinking about doing my outputs on 1 of my DCX's.
That depends how often it spends time jacked into an analog source.I almost always use my DCX in combination with the DEQ. So what I did was outfit the analog input of my DEQ with the input kit to minimize the total number of kits required to install for my needs.

After having completed the project myself I'd have rather had someone else do it (like shipping them my unit), as quality checking everything afterwards can be just as much a hassle as the initial install.

Sound-wise however, totally worth it. The hardware is state of the art in that regard.
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#8 Post by djtrumptight » Mon Mar 26, 2018 4:18 pm

Would using the digital output from the DEQ to the DCX digital input increase sound quality ? Thats actually how im running my system now,i have been running my tops in stereo but as soon as i can get outside and some tweaking im resetting my limiters and running a mono signal.
Built:
2 Autotuba's MCM 55 2421
8 T48's 24"wide 3015 LF
2 DR 250's melded Deltalite II 2510
2 DR 250's flat Deltalite II 2510
2 SLA HT systems
1 Table Tuba Dayton DCS 255-4
2 T 39's 20" wide 3012 LF
1 T-18 13" wide MCM 55 2421
2 SLA Pro's

CoronaOperator
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Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:07 pm
Location: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada

Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#9 Post by CoronaOperator » Thu Mar 29, 2018 3:33 am

BrentEvans wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:38 pm
My experience with the DCX has been that, when only used for crossover duty with moderate slopes (24db or less) they generally sound OK on entry level Systems. Load up the DSP more than that or get a better system and the flaws begin to show when compared to even something like the VENU360 or Ashly Protea line, which are not terribly expensive (certainly not at the level of units from Symetrix, BSS London or Lake).
Same thing with using SJ cable for speaker cable. OK on entry level systems but load up the DSP more than that and my cryogenic ones, which are a steal at the price btw and done slowly over the Canadian winters over the entire season, not just dipped in liquid nitrogen for 30 seconds, that's just lazy, and you will see the flaws in the untreated copper.

I have no doubt that you hear a difference, but after all the work you did on your mod, you now pay more attention to the sound now. I can't tell you how many times mixing bands that I've put in just the right amount of reverb and delay into their voice and then after the song was over when you go and reset everything for the next song, you see the red mute light on the effects. I've sat there an entire song moving the fader going in my head more, more, more, too much back off a bit, okay perfect and it was muted. Everybody who has ever mixed has a story like that. I've had musicians go more treble in their monitor, more, more, okay perfect and I wasn't even on their page yet to adjust their monitor. Working on it but 2 pages over (digital mixer). Spend the hour to watch the video beginning to last. Our perception of sound is very dependent on other cues.
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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Radian
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#10 Post by Radian » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:30 pm

djtrumptight wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 4:18 pm
Would using the digital output from the DEQ to the DCX digital input increase sound quality ? Thats actually how im running my system now,i have been running my tops in stereo but as soon as i can get outside and some tweaking im resetting my limiters and running a mono signal.
Certainly, over using the analog inputs to accomplish the same task. For DJ work, if raw SPL coverage isn't the only requirement, you'd be impressed at how wide of a stereo soundstage a system can actually throw if setup correctly to do so.
Good food, good people, good times.

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BrentEvans
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#11 Post by BrentEvans » Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:10 am

CoronaOperator wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 3:33 am
BrentEvans wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:38 pm
My experience with the DCX has been that, when only used for crossover duty with moderate slopes (24db or less) they generally sound OK on entry level Systems. Load up the DSP more than that or get a better system and the flaws begin to show when compared to even something like the VENU360 or Ashly Protea line, which are not terribly expensive (certainly not at the level of units from Symetrix, BSS London or Lake).
Same thing with using SJ cable for speaker cable. OK on entry level systems but load up the DSP more than that and my cryogenic ones, which are a steal at the price btw and done slowly over the Canadian winters over the entire season, not just dipped in liquid nitrogen for 30 seconds, that's just lazy, and you will see the flaws in the untreated copper.

I have no doubt that you hear a difference, but after all the work you did on your mod, you now pay more attention to the sound now. I can't tell you how many times mixing bands that I've put in just the right amount of reverb and delay into their voice and then after the song was over when you go and reset everything for the next song, you see the red mute light on the effects. I've sat there an entire song moving the fader going in my head more, more, more, too much back off a bit, okay perfect and it was muted. Everybody who has ever mixed has a story like that. I've had musicians go more treble in their monitor, more, more, okay perfect and I wasn't even on their page yet to adjust their monitor. Working on it but 2 pages over (digital mixer). Spend the hour to watch the video beginning to last. Our perception of sound is very dependent on other cues.
Um... I’m not the one with the modded units... I've just used a bunch of them, and quite a few much better units. If you think there's no difference you're deceiving yourself. Of course, if your primary evaluation is on cabs with piezo arrays, much of the difference gets lost in the smear of phase and response the arrays create.

Maybe next time check who you're responding to, though. :roll:
99% of the time, things that aren't already being done aren't being done because they don't work. The other 1% is split evenly between fools and geniuses.

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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#12 Post by byacey » Wed May 16, 2018 10:54 am

Behringer has developed an un-coveted reputation in the audio industry as a fine purveyor of bargain basement junk. Why would anyone modify / upgrade something not worthy of the time and money? I know the pricing looks attractive to someone just getting started, but it really isn't money well spent. Eventually you'll be replacing that gear with something better.
There. I said it.
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CoronaOperator
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Re: BehringerMods (AudioSmile) DCX output upgrade report

#13 Post by CoronaOperator » Thu May 17, 2018 1:30 am

Haters going to hate :cussing: . The DCX does momentarily drop outputs when changing certain parameters like delay, PEQ changing from + to - and crossing unity, etc which makes it not desirable for live use but for an install or set and forget it is a fantastic unit. DBX only wishes their units sound like the 2496. You really need to close your eyes and listen with your ears on this gem. It has no equal on sound and yes I own them all, the Venue 360, 260 and the pa+, this thing sounds better than all of them (because they are sandbagged so the DBX 4820 actually sells) which is why I have 2 :D .
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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