New Mixer Thoughts

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Chris_Allen
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#16 Post by Chris_Allen »

stefon74 wrote:I highly recommend this unit.
sample demo http://www.soundcraft.com/ui-demo/mixer.html
I tried this demo on my MacBook and Windows PC - crashed on both! Didn't crash on the iPad but it was very laggy.
Also struggled to move along the channel strip on all three machines, often inadvertantly changing the volume of the channel. Using the grouping to locate the channel you wanted felt to be a better way of doing it anyway. I also couldn't find a way to change the names of the Aux channels.

Looks pretty but I think it's not mature enough yet.
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doncolga
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#17 Post by doncolga »

The reception went great. Once dancing began it was non stop for two hours, so that was good. Totally insane the amount of sound coming out of Two OT12s and two Tuba 30 Slims. I did get the ipad working with the 16.0.2 this morning, but I didn't try to gig with it. I had only one "gotcha" moment with the mixer, which I guess was to be expected. I did a quick sound check (too quick) and everything seemed fine, but I didn't realize I had the compression threshold really low on my mic and the vocal was totally squashed. At the same instant I realized the wedding party didn't line up the same as the list I was given, so between those to I did get a little panicked. Rebounded very quickly though. I seriously think my rig has ever sounded better. This is the venue. http://thebellehousestatesboro.com/
Donny Collins
Built:
Two 18" Tuba 30's 3012 LF
Two 26" Tuba 30's Lab 12
Two OmniTop 12's DL 2512 (Melded Array)
Presonus Studio One DAW
Harrison Consoles MixBus 32C DAW

stefon74
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#18 Post by stefon74 »

Chris_Allen wrote:
stefon74 wrote:I highly recommend this unit.
sample demo http://www.soundcraft.com/ui-demo/mixer.html
I tried this demo on my MacBook and Windows PC - crashed on both! Didn't crash on the iPad but it was very laggy.
Also struggled to move along the channel strip on all three machines, often inadvertantly changing the volume of the channel. Using the grouping to locate the channel you wanted felt to be a better way of doing it anyway. I also couldn't find a way to change the names of the Aux channels.

Looks pretty but I think it's not mature enough yet.

gdougherty
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#19 Post by gdougherty »

Bruce Weldy wrote:
gdougherty wrote:I almost despise the physical interface on it. I can use them, but the whole translate the LED bar and read the right silk-screened info for the mode you're in drives me up the wall. Either give me a dedicated knob for the function, or put it on a display so I don't have to think too hard while I'm mixing.
???

I don't understand what you mean by this......are you talking about the LEDs on the 16 channel strips?

If that's what you mean, I've never had a problem telling the difference as to whether I'm looking at the input, monitor mix, EQ strip, etc. I flip back and forth without even thinking about it. I don't ever use a light unless I'm in a totally dark mix position....I know where everything is.

Not arguing, just trying to understand what you see as a problem.


I do wish there was a direct access to the GEQ on the 16.4.2 like there is on the 24.4.2....but, it's really not a problem after I have the system set....and I tend to use the PEQ on the master buss more anyway.
I use these a fair amount in darker environments and not being a regular user, the translation of the LED bars and markers to different values depending on the mode the mixer is in isn't immediately intuitive to me. I can use it, but I find myself thinking too hard about what's what.

Admittedly, I'm used to bigger boards with better information display that let me focus on the mix rather than how to use the board.

Bruce Weldy
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#20 Post by Bruce Weldy »

gdougherty wrote:
Bruce Weldy wrote:
gdougherty wrote:I almost despise the physical interface on it. I can use them, but the whole translate the LED bar and read the right silk-screened info for the mode you're in drives me up the wall. Either give me a dedicated knob for the function, or put it on a display so I don't have to think too hard while I'm mixing.
???

I don't understand what you mean by this......are you talking about the LEDs on the 16 channel strips?

If that's what you mean, I've never had a problem telling the difference as to whether I'm looking at the input, monitor mix, EQ strip, etc. I flip back and forth without even thinking about it. I don't ever use a light unless I'm in a totally dark mix position....I know where everything is.

Not arguing, just trying to understand what you see as a problem.


I do wish there was a direct access to the GEQ on the 16.4.2 like there is on the 24.4.2....but, it's really not a problem after I have the system set....and I tend to use the PEQ on the master buss more anyway.
I use these a fair amount in darker environments and not being a regular user, the translation of the LED bars and markers to different values depending on the mode the mixer is in isn't immediately intuitive to me. I can use it, but I find myself thinking too hard about what's what.

Admittedly, I'm used to bigger boards with better information display that let me focus on the mix rather than how to use the board.
Fair enough.....obviously, anything you are familiar with will be easier. And yeah, it's packed a lot of stuff in a small amount of real estate. But, to have a rack mountable board with 16 inputs (real inputs, not that 12 XLR/2 Stereo line that some call 16 channels), all the GEQs/PEQs, gates, compressors, EQ, 6 Auxes, and recallable scenes.....it's not going to be as easy to get around as a large format mixer.

I mixed a show last year on an LS9 - and I had to do some learning on the fly with it - certainly having more real estate available helps.

But after using the Presonus for more shows than I can count - it's second nature to me and makes me a better mixer than I was on analog.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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doncolga
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#21 Post by doncolga »

Hey all,

I DJ'ed a wedding reception on the 16.0.2 this evening. I was more familiar with it and the gig was more laid back than last time; end result was a stellar evening. I did much of the control directly from the Macbook and was also able to use the SL Remote app on the iPad. So much better to set the mix and the DriveRack from out in front and without any wires to boot. I have a live gig tomorrow in a local pub and I'm really looking forward to it.

I did have some connectivity issues between the iPad and the Presonus for the first part of the evening. A Google search revealed an easy fix. However, before that, it was very comforting to have physical control direct from the board in case I needed it. Definitely the right choice so far.

Donny
Donny Collins
Built:
Two 18" Tuba 30's 3012 LF
Two 26" Tuba 30's Lab 12
Two OmniTop 12's DL 2512 (Melded Array)
Presonus Studio One DAW
Harrison Consoles MixBus 32C DAW

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doncolga
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#22 Post by doncolga »

Here are some pictures to the last couple of gigs with the Presonus.

https://flic.kr/p/tnBnJ2
Donny Collins
Built:
Two 18" Tuba 30's 3012 LF
Two 26" Tuba 30's Lab 12
Two OmniTop 12's DL 2512 (Melded Array)
Presonus Studio One DAW
Harrison Consoles MixBus 32C DAW

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heavybdrums
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#23 Post by heavybdrums »

Have any of ya'll used or can compare the Allen & Heath QU series with the Presonus AI series?
I have looked at both and as far as most of the capabilities are concerned they seem to be comparable. I am looking at the 24 chan versions of both.
I am interested in the remote controllability and the ability to record all inputs direct into a computer or separate hard drive, as well as of course having gate/compressors and parametric eq of at least 4 bands on all mono inputs and auxes/sends.
One thing that is different with the Allen & Heath board is they have motorized faders for total mix recall, which makes me lean this way.
I'm not a fan of layered faders, but the Allen & Heath has 2 layers. I like the one button one control idea of not having to scroll through menus for dsp settings, and really for my needs/desires such a board really doesn't have to be so very compact as to require menu scrolling and multiple fader layers in a 24 channel board.
That being said I'm definitely into a physical digital board with optional wifi, direct recording ability, and all the dsp needed on every in and out and not so much into the stagebox with cat5 and wifi controll like the Presonus RM series. Also with the Presonus 24.4.2 ai as I understand it you only have reverb and delay as fx, which is fine for live sound but is a bit short handed when it comes to mixing a recording.
With all the reading I have done, I still cannot figure if it's possible to mix a recording on the board using the previously recorded multitracks from the computer,then the stereo track back into a computer without using a mouse to click and drag faders on a daw. In other words does the board have to be used to control a daw or can the board mix a recording without a daw to create a mixed/mastered recording?
Last edited by heavybdrums on Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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FrankORandle
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#24 Post by FrankORandle »

heavybdrums wrote:not so much into the stagebox with cat5
The Allen & Heath QU series is digital snake capable. I am going to get the 16 because I want the mixer rackmountable.
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heavybdrums
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#25 Post by heavybdrums »

Another factor for the Allen & Heath is that it uses the typical usb to connect to a computer or external hard drive, where the Presonus has to have firewire 800. One still has to have a Mac to have full mixing/recording control to mix a recording with the QU series, and the presonus Ai series can work on windows but you have to get a special Avb or firewire 800 pcie card for computer connectivity.
4x WH8 delta pro
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4x Dr250 Deltalite II 2510
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heavybdrums
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#26 Post by heavybdrums »

FrankORandle wrote:
heavybdrums wrote:not so much into the stagebox with cat5
The Allen & Heath QU series is digital snake capable. I am going to get the 16 because I want the mixer rackmountable.
Yes I saw that it can have the dsnake remote stage box. The curious thing is adding a stage box doesn't add channels to the board beyond its capability. Unless you are referring to using the stage box without a mixer and using wifi to mix with. That seemed a bit odd in that you already have preamps in the board and another set on stage, which are routed by default to their corresponding channels on the board. The ME personal monitor mix of the QU is more interesting to me, using a stage box for ME and a board for the FOH.
4x WH8 delta pro
2x WH10 Deltalite 2510
4x Dr250 Deltalite II 2510
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Tom Smit
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#27 Post by Tom Smit »

A&H only use iThings for remote, not Android.

Down-load and study the operator's manual to help you decide. It has more details in it than the sales page.
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NukePooch
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#28 Post by NukePooch »

Just looked at the A&H Qu24...Looks easy to navigate, I like the screen, and no 'fat channel' busyness...but am I missing something or are there no busses/DCA's? Maybe the two stereo-linked groups are all it's got?

Anyways, even if there were, you can't access them and individual channels at the same time. Personally, I'd pass. At least with the Presonus, you get 4 subgroups...If those were my only two options, it'd be the Presonus, no contest... The A&H seems to be a more flexible board, but without being able to have one hand on channels and the other on subgroups/DCA's, it's an absolute deal breaker for me.

(Of course, with the X32, you get all the connectivity, personal monitor mixes, digital snake capability, motorized faders, 32 channels, 8 DCA's, and it's cheaper...and you can mix your multitrack with it, no sweat.)
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BrentEvans
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#29 Post by BrentEvans »

The QU series do have 4 DCAs now... it was in one of the recent software updates. There is a third "custom" layer (press both layer buttons at the same time) where you can arrange things however you like.

In a typical band setup, a good use for this is to simply not put the drum kit on the custom layer. It's usually the first six or eight channels. That becomes a DCA. Then you can have 4 dcas and 2-4 effects channels on a layer with everything else.

One nice thing about the Qus is that they have FX sends on faders. That means you can mute the SEND, rather than the return. This lets your fx trail off naturally rather than just clipping the trails off.
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Re: New Mixer Thoughts

#30 Post by NukePooch »

Okay, I see the 'Custom' layer...

As long as you can have commonly used faders with the subgroups/DCA's, then I could figure it out. I often run, for instance, with one hand on the DCA's, and the other on the lead vocalist.

It's the one thing I don't like about my X32 Rack. Because there's not a lot of real estate on my Android tablet, I can't have DCA's and channel faders up at the same time...but the X32 Rack is so small and portable that, to me, it's a worthwhile tradeoff. However, talking full-sized consoles, it's a must... I like the split-design console.

It looks like you'd have to label everything with old-school board tape to keep it all straight. Another vote for LCD Scribble Strips!
Muting the FX sends are a nice option. I can mute group the FX sends, but personally I prefer to have the returns on a DCA, right next to the vocal DCA...

Well, to me, the Qu looks nice, but there's better options available with a whole lot more for a lot less money.
Built:
4 Jack 112L- 3012HO, melded array
17.5 wide AutoTuba with Infinity 860w
6 Wedgehorn W6 w/ Panel Mount Piezos
2 T48 Slims (15" wide) with 3012LF
4 T48 Fattys (32" wide) with 3015LF

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