TLAH PRO driver

Short and Transmission Line Arrays for Pros
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KyferEz
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TLAH PRO driver

#1 Post by KyferEz » Sun May 24, 2020 11:14 pm

Are these buyouts workable for tlah pro combined with the recommended 1016 tweets?
https://www.parts-express.com/dynalab-v ... --299-4004

Also any chance of a curved horizontal tlah pro with 8" speakers for use as a center channel, or maybe the 8 8" woofers stacked in 2 sets of 4 so it's under 4' tall, short enough to be used for center channel under a TV? I know that impacts the line; but not sure if it's doable or not?

Grant Bunter
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#2 Post by Grant Bunter » Mon May 25, 2020 2:17 am

They are more than 10% out just on Fs and Qts (compared to the Alpha 8A) and there's no response chart, so you'll need a yay or nay from Bill.

TLAH Pro isn't quite for HT, I reckon a curved SLA should be more than adequate for centre channel. Lots of small drivers in an arc is kinda what makes the Curved SLA work as a centre really...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#3 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Mon May 25, 2020 7:00 am

KyferEz wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 11:14 pm
Are these buyouts workable for tlah pro combined with the recommended 1016 tweets?
https://www.parts-express.com/dynalab-v ... --299-4004
That's not a pro-sound driver.
Also any chance of a curved horizontal tlah pro with 8" speakers for use as a center channel
HT doesn't need 8 inch drivers.

KyferEz
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Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: GA

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#4 Post by KyferEz » Mon May 25, 2020 8:44 am

Sigh. Fine I'll just have to extrapolate from your curvearray sla. Those small speakers don't have the lower midbass response at volume I'm after.

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#5 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Mon May 25, 2020 8:49 am

They're not supposed to. They must be used with subs.

KyferEz
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Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:37 pm
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#6 Post by KyferEz » Mon May 25, 2020 10:13 am

:horse: I know. But that still doesn't accomplish what I'm after. Think rock concert levels for HT. Think bass above the subs (in the 80-500Hz) that will kick you in the chest and really scare you.

Bruce Weldy
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#7 Post by Bruce Weldy » Mon May 25, 2020 10:49 am

KyferEz wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 10:13 am
:horse: I know. But that still doesn't accomplish what I'm after. Think rock concert levels for HT. Think bass above the subs (in the 80-500Hz) that will kick you in the chest and really scare you.
I'm not an HT expert, but the center channel is typically used for vocal content - I doubt there is much content in there that you want kicking you in the chest. Your LR speakers along with the subs should be taking care of that....

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#8 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Mon May 25, 2020 10:56 am

True. High energy content in HT media is mixed to L/R, not the center. That's why my six midbass CurveArray center is capable of keeping up with my two eight midbass TLAH L/R mains.

KyferEz
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Location: GA

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#9 Post by KyferEz » Mon May 25, 2020 11:05 am

Ok, that makes sense then, thanks.

Maybe this will help with what I'm after? I want to have something on the level of the below, but I was thinking of doing it with line arrays and folded horns.

Http://www.Basspig.com

http://www.basspig.com/images/Speakers% ... 202006.jpg

Bruce Weldy
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#10 Post by Bruce Weldy » Mon May 25, 2020 11:59 am

KyferEz wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 11:05 am
Ok, that makes sense then, thanks.

Maybe this will help with what I'm after? I want to have something on the level of the below, but I was thinking of doing it with line arrays and folded horns.

Http://www.Basspig.com

http://www.basspig.com/images/Speakers% ... 202006.jpg
I'll try to say this as nicely as possible.....

Based on the placement of those speakers alone, I don't think that's the site to use as a reference for building a system.

Why don't you tell us the size of your room, exactly what content you will be putting through the system, etc.

Lots of good experience here and a willingness to help you along the way. But, it might require re-thinking a lot of what you believe to be true.

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

KyferEz
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: GA

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#11 Post by KyferEz » Mon May 25, 2020 1:22 pm

Well maybe not, but he's quite an audiophile and it's built in a 2ft thick concrete walled basement designed as a bomb bunker. System is designed to overcome a 30ish hz null due to absorption in by the concrete. He's measured to having less than 3db change from 20hz to 20khz, of course he's using a dsp to accomplish that and his system is described as sounding like a well drilling machine from miles away.

I'll be building in my basement. Room I'll use is 12' tall, 12' wide, 30' long. I want each channel capable of hopefully 140db+ from 80hz up at about 10' away. Amps are 1200WRMS x 2ch into 4ohm and I have 4 of them, will be picking up a few more for the subs. Have run 220vac 200Amp feeder to basement already.

My main purpose is heavy metal and dubstep, but action movies are common as well, so still need the center. I've never been satisfied with any system's mid bass response, so this is hopefully to be the system to end all, so I'm asking for help to go stupid big this time.

I'm also used to car audio and sitting in basicly a sound box with 145db of bass with tons of highs, but was never happy with the quality: Most car audio is also lacking in mid bass. The closest thing I've experienced to what I want was being in the front row next to the speaker towers at an outdoor dubstep music festival.

Bruce Weldy
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Re: TLAH PRO driver

#12 Post by Bruce Weldy » Mon May 25, 2020 4:21 pm

In your earlier post, you said...
Think bass above the subs (in the 80-500Hz)
In my world, that's where most of the mud in a system occurs. So, trying to make that louder is probably not something I'd be very helpful with.

Also, the whole 140db at 10 feet is absolutely dangerous to your hearing - even for short periods.

I mixed a rock band last Saturday. My mix position was about 15 feet from the mains and I was hitting about 104db at my position. I even used ear plugs part of the time in order to keep my hearing useful for the rest of the show.

Not gonna' tell you what you want - but, I can't think of any Pro sound point source boxes that will give you 140db. Maybe with cabin gain you can get some big numbers, but I doubt it will be that high.....and I can't even imagine trying listen to anything at those levels.

It sounds like maybe your experience with auto sound is coloring your perceptions of what's possible in the real world.
He's measured to having less than 3db change from 20hz to 20khz
Sorry, but I have a real hard time believing that based on the picture of the system in the link.

Once again - I live in the live sound world and there are those more qualified in HT to jump in here, so I'll defer to them. But, that site had me shaking my head..... :mrgreen:

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

KyferEz
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: GA

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#13 Post by KyferEz » Mon May 25, 2020 5:47 pm

This kind of response is the norm... But at least now you understand what I'm after... Yes, it's dangerous levels, I know that 100%.

Bruce Weldy
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Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#14 Post by Bruce Weldy » Mon May 25, 2020 6:07 pm

Well, it sounds like 2-DR250s per side, 4 Tuba60s, SLA Pros for surrounds, 1-DR200 hung for Center channel.....that's enough SPL that would let you get it flat down to 25hz or so....with lots of EQ where you need it.

Oh, and one set of earplugs....

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

Grant Bunter
Posts: 6628
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:12 am
Location: Ilfracombe Queensland Australia
Contact:

Re: TLAH PRO driver

#15 Post by Grant Bunter » Mon May 25, 2020 6:23 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 6:07 pm
Well, it sounds like 2-DR250s per side, 4 Tuba60s, SLA Pros for surrounds, 1-DR200 hung for Center channel.....that's enough SPL that would let you get it flat down to 25hz or so....with lots of EQ where you need it.
mmm that would get near the target.

What's your woodworking skills like?
Any history in setting up PA?
Soldering?
Electronics?

I'm a bit confused with 140dB above 80Hz, since dubstep is largely about sub bass, more particularly that down to 25Hz ish.

Oh, and concrete mostly reflects, extraordinarily low amounts of absorption, and transmission. so the source of the 30Hz null could well have been the room, lack of treatment, and cab position...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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