Simplexx 110 Build

Post your build odyssey here.
Message
Author
User avatar
Bill Fitzmaurice
Site Admin
Posts: 26387
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 pm

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#121 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:16 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:03 pm
If you are playing large places with no PA support and you need to carry a big room from your rig, then you probably need something else.
Yes, you need PA support. :bash:
The S10 has minimum cone excursion from 40 to 60Hz. If you're getting too much excursion it means you've got way too much power below 40Hz. Bass amp EQ pre-shaping takes that into account. While the BP102 isn't a super premium driver it still has more xmax than the vast majority of tens used in manufactured cabs that amps are made to work with.

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#122 Post by Das Jugghead » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:49 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:03 pm
Das Jugghead wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 am
I am using several criteria in this search one being the presence of Speakon plugs for the speaker outputs - does this matter? Should I maintain consistency of Speakon to Speakon or am I okay going from a 1/4" output jack on the bass amp to the Speakon input jack on the Simplexx cabinets?
Doesn't matter at all. Just a different connector on each end of the cable. I've built some of these for my old bass player.
On that note if the Simplexx cabinets are not ideal for a five string bass what cabinet and speaker would be ideal for a five string bass playing hard/prog rock?
The answer is that they are ideal for 5 string bass. The answer is also that they are horrible for 5 string bass.

The real question is how you use them. Do you play through a PA with subs that handles getting your bass sound out front? Is your rig just there for you to monitor yourself? If yes, then the boxes you built should serve that purpose just fine.

Are you playing in small places with no PA support at reasonable levels? If so, then you should be fine.

If you are playing large places with no PA support and you need to carry a big room from your rig, then you probably need something else. That would either be a stack of Jack 12s (probably 4 of 'em), or a T39 (or 48)/OT12 combination. Then you'll need a proper crossover and a good bass preamp. This would let you use that Carvin amp you have......because you are essentially using your own small PA system.

It's always best to go as small as possible without a lot of low end on stage if you are playing through a PA - this keeps the bottom end on the stage from fighting the house sound.

Hey Bruce thank you again for the detailed feedback. I will try and reciprocate with my response.
Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:03 pm
Das Jugghead wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 am
I am using several criteria in this search one being the presence of Speakon plugs for the speaker outputs - does this matter? Should I maintain consistency of Speakon to Speakon or am I okay going from a 1/4" output jack on the bass amp to the Speakon input jack on the Simplexx cabinets?
Doesn't matter at all. Just a different connector on each end of the cable. I've built some of these for my old bass player.
I kind of figured but wanted to be sure that using a 1/4" to a Speakon would not create any issues. I do like that the Speakons lock in and cannot shake out.
Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:03 pm
Das Jugghead wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 am
On that note if the Simplexx cabinets are not ideal for a five string bass what cabinet and speaker would be ideal for a five string bass playing hard/prog rock?
The answer is that they are ideal for 5 string bass. The answer is also that they are horrible for 5 string bass.

The real question is how you use them. Do you play through a PA with subs that handles getting your bass sound out front? Is your rig just there for you to monitor yourself? If yes, then the boxes you built should serve that purpose just fine.

Are you playing in small places with no PA support at reasonable levels? If so, then you should be fine.
I am using them first for rehearsal with my hard rock/prog band. I need to keep up with and cut through two guitarists, a drummer, and a singer. I plan to use them for personal monitoring/stage sound initially. Ultimately I hope to have the entire band go to IEM's and forego amps and cabinets on stage but that is a ways down the road. All of our shows will be with PA support (SR for the purists?) so these cabinets would not be carrying my sound for the venue. I am thinking that based on the fact that I am not sure the current BP102's will keep up/cut through that I may replace them with EMINENCE KAPPA PRO-10LF speakers and not run them as hard as the current BP102's.

I remembered that I have an MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal so I brought that out and played direct through that into the Carvin DCM 3800L. After some knob fiddling I was able to get things to sound better. Here is a link for it:

MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... ass-preamp

Which has gotten me to wondering if I the MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal in between my Zoom B3n and the Carvin DCM 3800L would be an acceptable preamp - thoughts? Feedback? Suggestions?
Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:03 pm
It's always best to go as small as possible without a lot of low end on stage if you are playing through a PA - this keeps the bottom end on the stage from fighting the house sound.
In recent years I have become a champion of smaller is better and easier - ergo the Simplexx build. I am done lugging refrigerators and unwieldy heads up/down stairs, across muddy fields in the dark, and fighting for footprint space on stage for my rig. It took me awhile to figure out that dialing back the low-end helps me stand out in the mix during rehearsals and shows. It isn't the sound or tone I enjoy when jamming by myself but it does make a huge difference in clarity.

Thank you again for all of your patient responses.

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 6418
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#123 Post by Bruce Weldy » Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:15 pm

Which has gotten me to wondering if I the MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal in between my Zoom B3n and the Carvin DCM 3800L would be an acceptable preamp - thoughts? Feedback? Suggestions?
You said that you are using the Zoom with no effects and no cab sim......so, why use it at all? Just go with the MXR if it sounds good.

I'd still look into getting a small bass head and do away with all the other stuff.

If you have good monitors, you can go direct with the bass through the wedge and not even wait for in-ears. Walk in with the bass and start playing.

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#124 Post by Das Jugghead » Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:15 pm
Which has gotten me to wondering if I the MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal in between my Zoom B3n and the Carvin DCM 3800L would be an acceptable preamp - thoughts? Feedback? Suggestions?
You said that you are using the Zoom with no effects and no cab sim......so, why use it at all? Just go with the MXR if it sounds good.
I should have been clearer in my post in that I was running the Zoom B3n without effects or cab sims in order to isolate what the cause of the farting out was.
Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:15 pm
I'd still look into getting a small bass head and do away with all the other stuff.
I may end up going this route.
Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:15 pm
If you have good monitors, you can go direct with the bass through the wedge and not even wait for in-ears. Walk in with the bass and start playing.
Around here I have never been able to get a sound man to put bass in the monitors. I have always had to use my cabinets as my own personal monitors which works fine as long as I don't move around.

User avatar
Bill Fitzmaurice
Site Admin
Posts: 26387
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 pm

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#125 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:00 pm

The MXR and 3800 may be OK, my only concern with the MXR is that it probably isn't high passed. I can't relate to the Zoom, I've never used any effects on bass save a bit of compression.

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 6418
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#126 Post by Bruce Weldy » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:31 pm

Das Jugghead wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 pm

Around here I have never been able to get a sound man to put bass in the monitors. I have always had to use my cabinets as my own personal monitors which works fine as long as I don't move around.
Wow.....as a sound man, I'm ecstatic when a bass player wants to go direct without an amp. That means I get total control of the bottom end.

Only reason I can imagine to not want to do that is if the monitors can't reproduce below 100hz.....

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#127 Post by Das Jugghead » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:34 am

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:00 pm
The MXR and 3800 may be OK, my only concern with the MXR is that it probably isn't high passed. I can't relate to the Zoom, I've never used any effects on bass save a bit of compression.
I will have to do some research to see if the MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal is high passed but I am pretty sure the Zoom B3n is not - will try and do some digging on that as well. I rarely used effects but when the Zoom came out with all the different amp and cab simulations I had to jump on it.

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#128 Post by Das Jugghead » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:44 am

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:31 pm
Das Jugghead wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:53 pm

Around here I have never been able to get a sound man to put bass in the monitors. I have always had to use my cabinets as my own personal monitors which works fine as long as I don't move around.
Wow.....as a sound man, I'm ecstatic when a bass player wants to go direct without an amp. That means I get total control of the bottom end.

Only reason I can imagine to not want to do that is if the monitors can't reproduce below 100hz.....
I am not sure what the reasoning behind it is. Most sound men here are beyond reproach and will not discuss how or why something is the way it is. I have even gone so far as to buy some of them dinner or a few beers and still no communication. The closest we have gotten to an answer was "monitors are only for vocals."

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 6418
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#129 Post by Bruce Weldy » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:01 am

Das Jugghead wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:44 am

I am not sure what the reasoning behind it is. Most sound men here are beyond reproach and will not discuss how or why something is the way it is. I have even gone so far as to buy some of them dinner or a few beers and still no communication. The closest we have gotten to an answer was "monitors are only for vocals."
Wow, that's sad. I relish every opportunity that comes along when a musician wants to know "why". The more I can teach about how sound works, the better chance I have of getting them to do the things I want - then the better chance that I can make 'em sound good.

As far as I'm concerned, the pay I get isn't worth listening to 4 hours of crappy-sounding music.

But I admit, there are some jaded, worn-out soundmen out there. They sit there with their head in their iPhone during the whole show, ignoring the obvious issues that are going on with the sound.

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

User avatar
Bill Fitzmaurice
Site Admin
Posts: 26387
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 pm

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#130 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:29 am

Das Jugghead wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:44 am
I am not sure what the reasoning behind it is. Most sound men here are beyond reproach and will not discuss how or why something is the way it is. I have even gone so far as to buy some of them dinner or a few beers and still no communication. The closest we have gotten to an answer was "monitors are only for vocals."
They're not professionals, that's for sure. IME most sound men aren't. They usually get their start as a friend of the band, maybe a musician not good enough to be in the band, maybe just a hanger-on. Some take their business seriously and actually learn the trade, but most don't. By and large as you go up the food chain the hacks get weeded out, but even in the ranks of pro-touring I've come across bozos who shouldn't be allowed near a board.

Monitors are for whatever the band members need to hear. That includes the bass, although in most cases you'd high pass the bass at 100-150Hz. The back line usually provides all of the low end you need on stage, it's just the directional mids and highs that might need to go through the monitors so everyone who wants to hear them can. The exception would be the drummer's monitor, which might run the full range of the bass on a very large stage.

Askia
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 12:48 am
Location: Hungary (Central-Europe)

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#131 Post by Askia » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:41 pm

Hello everyone at the high-pass filter club! :)
Zoom B3n has received in the 2017 may-june update a "Low Eq" effect, which is a high pass filter. You should play with that! (Also could try the bass amp sims, if they are there. :) )

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#132 Post by Das Jugghead » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:51 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:01 am
Das Jugghead wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:44 am

I am not sure what the reasoning behind it is. Most sound men here are beyond reproach and will not discuss how or why something is the way it is. I have even gone so far as to buy some of them dinner or a few beers and still no communication. The closest we have gotten to an answer was "monitors are only for vocals."
Wow, that's sad. I relish every opportunity that comes along when a musician wants to know "why". The more I can teach about how sound works, the better chance I have of getting them to do the things I want - then the better chance that I can make 'em sound good.

As far as I'm concerned, the pay I get isn't worth listening to 4 hours of crappy-sounding music.

But I admit, there are some jaded, worn-out soundmen out there. They sit there with their head in their iPhone during the whole show, ignoring the obvious issues that are going on with the sound.
Bill Fitzmaurice wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:29 am
Das Jugghead wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:44 am
I am not sure what the reasoning behind it is. Most sound men here are beyond reproach and will not discuss how or why something is the way it is. I have even gone so far as to buy some of them dinner or a few beers and still no communication. The closest we have gotten to an answer was "monitors are only for vocals."
They're not professionals, that's for sure. IME most sound men aren't. They usually get their start as a friend of the band, maybe a musician not good enough to be in the band, maybe just a hanger-on. Some take their business seriously and actually learn the trade, but most don't. By and large as you go up the food chain the hacks get weeded out, but even in the ranks of pro-touring I've come across bozos who shouldn't be allowed near a board.

Monitors are for whatever the band members need to hear. That includes the bass, although in most cases you'd high pass the bass at 100-150Hz. The back line usually provides all of the low end you need on stage, it's just the directional mids and highs that might need to go through the monitors so everyone who wants to hear them can. The exception would be the drummer's monitor, which might run the full range of the bass on a very large stage.

There are a few good sound men on the scene but they are few and far between. The scene here in Indy has languished since the end of the eighties and many factors have contributed to this. Sound men have played their part but moronic band members have outdone themselves as well. I think when it comes to stage sound the best bet on a number of fronts is for everyone go IEM's and forego amps and cabs on stage.

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 6418
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#133 Post by Bruce Weldy » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:59 pm

Das Jugghead wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:51 pm
I think when it comes to stage sound the best bet on a number of fronts is for everyone go IEM's and forego amps and cabs on stage.
No question that it will sound better to the crowd.....maybe not the players - but, that's the decision that should be made. Do we care more about how it sounds to us on stage or how it sounds to the people we are here to entertain.

I don't mind monitors - at least they are pointed backwards. IEMs are just a bonus.

But, running the instruments direct gets me all tingly all over. :mrgreen:

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#134 Post by Das Jugghead » Sat Feb 17, 2018 4:23 pm

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:59 pm
Das Jugghead wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:51 pm
I think when it comes to stage sound the best bet on a number of fronts is for everyone go IEM's and forego amps and cabs on stage.
No question that it will sound better to the crowd.....maybe not the players - but, that's the decision that should be made. Do we care more about how it sounds to us on stage or how it sounds to the people we are here to entertain.

I don't mind monitors - at least they are pointed backwards. IEMs are just a bonus.

But, running the instruments direct gets me all tingly all over. :mrgreen:
I agree. For now though I am going to pick up a preamp pedal from Mesa Boogie as it has the HPF and I think I will replace the speakers as soon as finances allow.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SubwayDIPreu1

Das Jugghead
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:08 pm
Location: Indianapolis

Re: Simplexx 110 Build

#135 Post by Das Jugghead » Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:06 pm

Here are some pictures of the cabinets:
27783744_1832619100081416_116887502_n.jpg
27847915_1832619126748080_1380111121_n.jpg
27993868_1832619063414753_1385466597_n.jpg
27951443_1832412813435378_48263203_o.jpg
27907123_1832412870102039_870734079_o.jpg
27993868_1832619063414753_1385466597_n.jpg

Ran them hard in rehearsal today. I ran the bass into the MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal and then into the Carvin DCM 3800L. The MXR M81 Bass Preamp Pedal does have a HPF and this has helped with farting. Despite the fact that the 200 watt speakers had trouble cutting through two guitarists and a drummer they did remarkably well in terms of clarity - they just need to be louder. I think I am going to invest in a set of speakers next month. I am also eyeballing the Mesa/Boogie Subway DI peramp pedal.

Post Reply