Church in a comedy club

Combining subs, tops and all the rest of your kit.
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tvent
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:29 pm
Location: Helena, AR

Re: Church in a comedy club

#16 Post by tvent » Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:33 pm

FrankD wrote:
Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:03 pm
I assume your experience is with the 4 driver / full size version. Which drivers do you have?

Do you have any guidance on the horizontal dispersion of the SLA-PROs?
Correct FrankD, I went with the 4 driver / full size version. Even at full size, these things are very compact. I can't imagine how small the 4" version must be in real life. That might be an option for your delay stack as well - that would certainly reduce the "visibility" impact on your congregation.

I ended up going with the Eminence Alpha 6(a) drivers.
I was on the fence and just about to pull the trigger on the much less expensive Dayton Audio's, but Parts Express ran a sale on the Alpha's about a week before I was ready to build and a vendor I had a credit with honored a price match, so I went ahead with the Eminence. I wanted to do the new Alphalite's, but my timeframe and budget dictated otherwise. I'm very happy with what I ended up with.
The Alpha's at the sale price made my driver investment about double the Daytons, but I do like to stay with recommended drivers when possible.
Had I gone with the Dayton's, I was going to incorporate a 12db low-pass filter around 3.5k to try to tame their 5k rise that the Eminence's don't have.
I was also worried about the lack of xmax info on the Dayton option, but now after hearing these and realizing that they do pretty much NOTHING below 100Hz, I'm not sure that is an issue - just high pass at 100 and I'm sure they would be fine.
In fact, at one event I ran them up to about 120/130 and my T39's low pass down to about 70 and got quite a pleasing sound in that particular venue (playing pre-recorded music.)

Since Bill chimed in with the great animation on dispersion, I won't go into detail - but suffice it to say these have done just fine in both long/skinny halls and the short/wide auditorium I was in this weekend. There was a nice and wide sweet spot in the auditorium. That being said, I do think I want to build a 2x6" version to do the stacking with the short ones on the bottom of the stack and turned inward as has been mentioned to create a "best of both worlds" situation with wide coverage for the close audience and long-throw for those in the rear.
Built:
4 x WH10 melded
4 x WH8 melded
2 x Jack15 melded
2 x Simplex 12 w/BGH-25 for Bass
1 x Simplex Tiltback (powered PPA800DSP) for Keys
2 x SLA Pro
Bought:
6 x T39 20" 3012LF loaded

ACUA
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:21 pm

Re: Church in a comedy club

#17 Post by ACUA » Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:55 pm

Most basic pa rigs get it wrong, mid level consumer line array are pretty close only high end pa are squared away like the EAW Anya rigs and who can afford that stuff. The diffraction horns and melded array Bill perscribes, all be it seemingly counter intuitive are by my estimations pretty correct in design. Other wise I would not have built them then.
Advanced concepts underground audio

tvent
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:29 pm
Location: Helena, AR

Re: Church in a comedy club

#18 Post by tvent » Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:56 pm

ACUA wrote:
Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:55 pm
Most basic pa rigs get it wrong, mid level consumer line array are pretty close only high end pa are squared away like the EAW Anya rigs and who can afford that stuff. The diffraction horns and melded array Bill perscribes, all be it seemingly counter intuitive are by my estimations pretty correct in design. Other wise I would not have built them then.
Definitely counter-intuitive to conventional wisdom (it just "looks" wrong), and it took me a while to accept this as fact, but once you know better, you do better. Many thanks to Bill and this forum for setting us straight over the years.
Built:
4 x WH10 melded
4 x WH8 melded
2 x Jack15 melded
2 x Simplex 12 w/BGH-25 for Bass
1 x Simplex Tiltback (powered PPA800DSP) for Keys
2 x SLA Pro
Bought:
6 x T39 20" 3012LF loaded

CoronaOperator
Posts: 1493
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:07 pm
Location: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada

Re: Church in a comedy club

#19 Post by CoronaOperator » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:48 pm

In case you couldn't get the plugin to work, here is a video of a real world wave table demonstrating the fact:

Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

tvent
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:29 pm
Location: Helena, AR

Re: Church in a comedy club

#20 Post by tvent » Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:15 pm

Anyone looked at these neo's as a suitable replacement for the SLA Pro's:
https://www.parts-express.com/prv-audio ... --294-2701
Specs are within reason, and at 1/3rd the weight of the Alpha's and still a whole pound less per driver than the new Alphalites - would make for ~20 pounds per cabinet for the 4x6".
Interesting.
Built:
4 x WH10 melded
4 x WH8 melded
2 x Jack15 melded
2 x Simplex 12 w/BGH-25 for Bass
1 x Simplex Tiltback (powered PPA800DSP) for Keys
2 x SLA Pro
Bought:
6 x T39 20" 3012LF loaded

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Bill Fitzmaurice
Site Admin
Posts: 26458
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 pm

Re: Church in a comedy club

#21 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:47 pm

The break up mode is pretty nasty.

tvent
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:29 pm
Location: Helena, AR

Re: Church in a comedy club

#22 Post by tvent » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:14 pm

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:47 pm
The break up mode is pretty nasty.
I thought it was too good to be true. Thanks.
Built:
4 x WH10 melded
4 x WH8 melded
2 x Jack15 melded
2 x Simplex 12 w/BGH-25 for Bass
1 x Simplex Tiltback (powered PPA800DSP) for Keys
2 x SLA Pro
Bought:
6 x T39 20" 3012LF loaded

Bruce Weldy
Posts: 6449
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:37 am
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Church in a comedy club

#23 Post by Bruce Weldy » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:39 pm

CoronaOperator wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:48 pm
In case you couldn't get the plugin to work, here is a video of a real world wave table demonstrating the fact:


That is really good to visualize what's happening. Thanks for posting that.

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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Tom Smit
Posts: 6619
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Sarnia, Ont. Canada

Re: Church in a comedy club

#24 Post by Tom Smit » Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:14 am

Bruce Weldy wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:39 pm
CoronaOperator wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:48 pm
In case you couldn't get the plugin to work, here is a video of a real world wave table demonstrating the fact:
That is really good to visualize what's happening. Thanks for posting that.
+1
TomS

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