Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

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kdrums
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Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#1 Post by kdrums » Wed Feb 01, 2017 4:45 pm

OK. Glad to be on this site! So much knowledge and support from people who actually care about proper sound. . I have a friend who has built many T48's/Omni's and I have mixed several gigs inside and out with BFM cabs. I was sold on day 1. Now it's my turn. Building a "small" rig that will fit in my SUV. Big shows I will just borrow his ;-) I am Going with 2 jack 10's on sticks with melded arrays, 2 T39's 15" wide w/v plate and 4 Wedgehorn 6's for monitors. All premium drivers. Wish me luck. Need to get er done for summer patio shows and small venue's

Looking forward to posting pics someday of the little rig that could ;-) :hyper:

I know where to come with questions, that's for sure....

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Chris_Allen
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#2 Post by Chris_Allen » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:00 pm

Welcome aboard!

Can you make your T39's 16"? That's the minimum width for the 3012LF or Lab12 which gives you the best output to size ratio.

Are you always going to use subs? If so, I would skip the Jacks and build OmniTops instead.
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#3 Post by kdrums » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:21 pm

Pack space is my number 1 concern for this build. I was planning on ordering the 15" config flat pack through speakerhardware as it is my understanding that is the smallest i can go with a 12" T39 yes?. I know i can get pre-cut 15/18/20 and so on etc.

I did consider the Omni's as well but the jacks are ever so slightly smaller. I will at times use the Jack 10's in my car with an amp/processor case/small mixer etc for acoustic gigs so o tops wont cut it. I am truly going for "wow" all that is coming out of that little PA and a swiss army knife of sorts. I have used many small subcompact commercial rigs over the last few years at 5-10 times the cost that on paper cant even touch the smallest BFM rig as I am planning.

Thank you very much for your reply

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Tom Smit
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#4 Post by Tom Smit » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:19 am

Welcome to the forum! Enjoy your builds!
TomS

Grant Bunter
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#5 Post by Grant Bunter » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:07 am

Yes indeed, welcome to the forum :)

Don't second guess your pack space. Build some cardboard mockups of the cab sizes you intend to build (Jacks and T39's), and see if that takes up all your pack space, or no. Or that maybe a bit of cab tetris will give you more space than you thought you had.

Reasoning;
The wider you can get your T39's, the better the output.
Similarly, J12's will do better than J10's.
I think that's important for you when are have heard Otops...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 (melded array) with March 2012 plans. 2 more under way with CD horn
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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DJPhatman
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#6 Post by DJPhatman » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:46 pm

Grant Bunter wrote:Similarly, J12's will do better than J10's.
Grant, I believe you meant to say OT12s will do better than J10s.

kdrums, Do yourself a favor, and build OT12s with cross-fired melded arrays. Small, intimate gatherings? Use 1 of each. Bigger gatherings? Bring it all. Modular is the key here. Always bi-amp, tops and subs. This keeps your sound whole. I (we) totally understand about pack space. This is why we recommend
Grant Bunter wrote: Build some cardboard mockups of the cab sizes you intend to build
I know money often seals the deal, but seriously, quality is an investment, not an expense... Grant Bunter
Accept the fact that airtight and well-braced are more important than pretty on the inside. Bill Fitzmaurice

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Chris_Allen
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#7 Post by Chris_Allen » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:28 am



Two (+3dB) Vplated (+3dB) 16" T39s have the same sensitivity as one 30" wide one whilst being 3" thinner in pack space.

15" is too narrow for the 3012LF, 16" is your minimum width and you are just throwing away free low end response.

Building one 28" 3012LF T39 will probably give you more output that a two 10" driver, 15" wide T39s with less pack space. The 24" will probably be a couple of dB down above 50Hz.
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#8 Post by kdrums » Sun Feb 05, 2017 1:53 pm

Thank you ALL for your feedback. I amgoing to re think things. I am going to make cardboard mock ups
And play around...

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#9 Post by kdrums » Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:05 pm

In relation to the recommendation to just jump up to the Otop 12. I am going to be doing an acoustic act in a few weeks for about 100 folks with my good friends O top wide cabs. NO subs. We are talking fiddle, acoustic gutiar, accordian, etc(folk/Irish). This would be the type of gig I was thinking the Jack would be the better fit for. After further review I think I can pull it off with the Otop12 wide. I am not looking for high SPL's for this type of event I would run without subs. Not allot going on under 100 with this style of music. After looking at dimensions, Jack 10's only save me a few inches in pack space.

Now onto the other noted comment regarding Bi amping. I was not planning on BI-amping for my future build again due to simplified setup and less amp channels. I understand the benefits but this is to be my Mini rig. I am willing to consider it in case I wanted to scale to larger more efficient scenario down the road.

Thanks again for folks that have chimed in. I am not rushing in to my build(s) going to take my time and do it right the first time for my needs. I am willing to listen to all suggestions.

Bruce Weldy
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#10 Post by Bruce Weldy » Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:32 pm

O top wide cabs.
Otop12 wide.

What is an OT12 wide? Pretty sure they only come in one width.

6 - T39 4-25" 2-22" 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512 Melded/NSD2005
1 - T24
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#11 Post by kdrums » Sun Feb 05, 2017 7:28 pm

Bruce, by wide I meant cross-fired melded arrays vs long throw.

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#12 Post by kdrums » Sun Feb 05, 2017 7:34 pm

Chris, it seems the single 30 would be the most bang for the buck/setup. Not to mention saves on cost for initial build. Yes 1 big box, but then I could build another. Very tough considering I was trying to make the PA also look as small as possible for aesthetics in addition to pack space concerns. You know how venue owners can be.. Also considering sub placement/experimentation dependent on venue config is always a concern. There is always a trade off.

Decisions, decisions.......

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kdrums
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#13 Post by kdrums » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:14 pm

Chris_Allen wrote:Welcome aboard!

Can you make your T39's 16"? That's the minimum width for the 3012LF or Lab12 which gives you the best output to size ratio.

Are you always going to use subs? If so, I would skip the Jacks and build OmniTops instead.

Ok for the subs, after some Cardboard tetris I think i can get away with 18-20" cabs. Now what driver 3012LF or Lab12? Is it just a weight difference? if so how much?

Grant Bunter
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Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#14 Post by Grant Bunter » Wed Feb 08, 2017 3:38 pm

7ish pounds for the 3012lf, 22 ish pounds for the Lab12.

Since there's no difference in output between the 2, and about $10 in price difference, the only thing left to worry about is your back. You'll appreciate the lighter weight of the 3012lf, especially at the end of the night...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 (melded array) with March 2012 plans. 2 more under way with CD horn
T39's: 4 x 20" BP102 , 2 x 28" 3012lf.
WH8: x 3 with melded array.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Chris_Allen
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Location: Huddersfield, UK

Re: Hello! Newbie here. I have my plans and getting ready to build me some greatness!

#15 Post by Chris_Allen » Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:10 pm

Grant Bunter wrote:7ish pounds for the 3012lf, 22 ish pounds for the Lab12.

Since there's no difference in output between the 2, and about $10 in price difference, the only thing left to worry about is your back. You'll appreciate the lighter weight of the 3012lf, especially at the end of the night...
Would the 3012LF also generate less heat and have a lower risk of driver failure?
Built:
6xDR200, 2xT39, 2xT48, 2xJack110, 1xOmni10.5, 1xAutotuba, 1xT18, 1xSLA Pro, 1xW8, 1xW10

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