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bmf
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 11:03 pm
Location: Muncie, IN

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#1 Post by bmf »

Hello to everybody,

I've been involved in running sound for about 25 years now but have just recently got into the build thing. I do live work for a couple bands and my kids have recently started doing DJ work. We work at least one night a week and sometimes two to three with different rigs going different places on the same night. I recently just finished a batch of asymmetrical tapped horns that absolutely destroy my current mid/tops. I'm looking at building dr200's (with planerwave ribbons) or dr250's. As I get older I find myself moving back to the high efficiency way of doing things and further from the big power game. Getting back to horn loaded cabinets is simply a must. The beautiful coverage pattern of line array just makes it sweater. Whatever I end up building will be well documented and posted as well as final impressions.
Looking forward to getting going on some new saw dust.

Brian Faulkner

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Bas Gooiker
Posts: 752
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 5:05 pm

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#2 Post by Bas Gooiker »

welcome to the forum...

Looking forward to seeing some buildthreads... any perticular reason you are going for ribbons in the DR's?
Life is just a game, don't take it to seriously!

bmf
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 11:03 pm
Location: Muncie, IN

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#3 Post by bmf »

I like the fact that ribbons (most anyway) can usually be ran to their limit without changes in dispersion or the development of high resonate artifacts. I am, in fact however, a long time cd user. I have yet to get the plans so am unaware of how the highend section of these two cabinets incorporate cd's. If they use an existing horn or if the throat and flare are structure based. I will be doing a lot of research before construction. To be honest I would prefer cd's for the durability and my own familiarity with them. I do however know the ribbons will align perfectly without variation and give me an extremely wide dispersion while still having good forward projection. I am aware this is where I will get hit with the "why not piezo" question. The truth is I have just had to many bad experiences with them. I'll explain; Most piezos I have had experience with have had pretty extreme variation in output both in response and in spl. The other main issue I have dealt with is when pushed very hard they tend to resonate. In fairness this has been on cheap cabinets I have worked on or with for other people and I have no idea what brands or models where used. (although these where arrayed) I would love to actually hear some of these cabinets in person and may try to do this before any builds.

Anybody in central Indiana?

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BrentEvans
Posts: 3044
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:38 am
Location: Salisbury, NC

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#4 Post by BrentEvans »

Bas Gooiker wrote:. any perticular reason you are going for ribbons in the DR's?
Cause'n they's better.

:mrgreen:

Then again, I might be a bit biased in that regard.
99% of the time, things that aren't already being done aren't being done because they don't work. The other 1% is split evenly between fools and geniuses.

bmf
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 11:03 pm
Location: Muncie, IN

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#5 Post by bmf »

Maybe just a little :wink:

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Tom Smit
Posts: 7457
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Sarnia, Ont. Canada

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#6 Post by Tom Smit »

Welcome to the forum, Brian! It sounds like you should get the CD of plans. 8)

Piezos have been used in the wrong applications and therefore get a bad rap. The flat array and melded array allow the piezos to be not driven as hard and therefore stay nice sounding all the while throwing the sound farther and controlling the output pattern.
TomS

CoronaOperator
Posts: 1648
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:07 pm
Location: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada

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#7 Post by CoronaOperator »

bmf wrote: The other main issue I have dealt with is when pushed very hard they tend to resonate
In the DR200 there are 16 of them , the DR250 20 of them. Each individual piezo isn't pushed anywhere near their potential, they only idle ... Barely!
bmf wrote:In fairness this has been on cheap cabinets I have worked on
In those cabs, im assuming no crossovers (natual rolloff on the woofer with cone breakup (sounds really bad) and no crossover or filter on the piezo (they natually roll off below 2k), most likely overlap between the two, cheap yes, sound good , no! Great speaker design is all in the crossover/filters used.
bmf wrote:Most piezos I have had experience with have had pretty extreme variation in output both in response and in spl.
Your right on discovering that one. Bill has too! That's why in the plans he recommends buying a couple extra ($2.50 each) and outlines a procedure for testing them. You discard the outliers and the remainders (in numbers, remember 20 in the DR250) blend to even themselves out. Strength in numbers. The last piece of the puzzle is that EQ is REQUIRED for these cabs. You will get peaks (piezos around 8-10k) that need to be tamed by EQ.

The advantage to the piezo arrays is the dispersion (120 degrees), the other options (cd) doesn't offer that kind of dispersion. Its the people up close that need it the most.
Built:
17" width 10" driver Autotuba
2 x 29" width dual Lab12 Tuba60
6 x DR250 2510/asd1001
In progress:
2 x DR250 2510/asd1001
For best results, point the loud end of the array towards the audience

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BrentEvans
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Location: Salisbury, NC

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#8 Post by BrentEvans »

CoronaOperator wrote: The advantage to the piezo arrays is the dispersion (120 degrees), the other options (cd) doesn't offer that kind of dispersion. Its the people up close that need it the most.
Ribbons horizonal dispersion is about 160-170 degrees. Just sayin'. :)
99% of the time, things that aren't already being done aren't being done because they don't work. The other 1% is split evenly between fools and geniuses.

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