Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

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Seth
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Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#1 Post by Seth »

I have 4 Delta 12LFA's laying around that aren't slated for anything at the moment. The thought crossed my mind to assemble a DJ rig for small/medium venues, house parties, pubs/bars, outdoor patio sort of places. I've been reading through the literature about the Tuba30 and Tuba45 and have a couple questions.

The sales/information page says the T45 has similar response to a T30. Reading through the plans, the voltage limit for the Delta 12LFA is 5 volts higher in the T30. I assume this indicates that the driver reaches the same displacement on less voltage in the T45. Which, if true, I kinda like.

The T30 design is able to take advantage of the benefits of V-plating. To me, I see this as a possible indication that this driver is potentially capable of more peak output in 4 V-plated T30's than in 4 T45's. True?

Also, the max width's are different. 30" max for the T30 vs. 24" max for the T45. I'm not quite sure what to make of that information. Is the max width response also similar, or is it more similar on an inch for inch basis and the wider T30 has additional sensitivity?

Which design would have the advantage in maximum output potential, assuming each at a width of 24" and the T30's being V-plated? What about at max widths?

Thanks a bunch :thumbsup:
Last edited by Seth on Sun Nov 15, 2020 3:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Grant Bunter
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#2 Post by Grant Bunter »

Since the T45 is essentially a refolded T30 to give a different form factor, you should treat both as identical in output, and the extra 5V in one plan is either a typo, or, the plans come from differing periods and an adjustment was made in the more recent ones (T45) for a greater safety margin.

V plating is handy, when you can. It would take up more real estate in a house party though. It will help increase low output, by up to 3dB, depending on driver.

I imagine a redraw saw either increased throat pressures in the T45, or, the other alternative was that after 24" wide there was not a significant enough increase in output to warrant building wider. Of course, a 24" wide cab also works very well with ripping 4 x 8 sheets lengthwise, with enough to allow for untrue stock...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Seth
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#3 Post by Seth »

Grant Bunter wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 2:45 am Since the T45 is essentially a refolded T30 to give a different form factor, you should treat both as identical in output, and the extra 5V in one plan is either a typo, or, the plans come from differing periods and an adjustment was made in the more recent ones (T45) for a greater safety margin.

V plating is handy, when you can. It would take up more real estate in a house party though. It will help increase low output, by up to 3dB, depending on driver.

I imagine a redraw saw either increased throat pressures in the T45, or, the other alternative was that after 24" wide there was not a significant enough increase in output to warrant building wider. Of course, a 24" wide cab also works very well with ripping 4 x 8 sheets lengthwise, with enough to allow for untrue stock...
Hi Grant :thumbsup:

They're not identical in horn path dimensions. Similar. But, not the same. Which would explain why they reportedly have "similar response" and not identical response. And if they were identical, or we at least treated them as such, is it inch for inch in cab width, leaving room for the T30 to outperform in wider widths than the T45's max? Or, minimum width to maximum width identical with a 24" wide T45 performing the same as a 30" wide T30?

See, too many variables that don't add up, 1 to 1, for me to consider them identical. Can you point out where I should consider them identical?

I really do like the thought of an additional 3dB on the bottom end with the V-plate, essentially for free. That's huge!
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

Grant Bunter
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#4 Post by Grant Bunter »

SethRocksYou wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 3:32 am They're not identical in horn path dimensions. Similar. But, not the same. Which would explain why they reportedly have "similar response" and not identical response. And if they were identical, or we at least treated as such...
The history of the T45 evolved with sufficient calls for an end firing sub not as large as a fridge. I assume this, but rather than scale down the T60, Bill refolded the T30 (or maybe a bit of both).
Since the 2 cabs have different dimensions, and have different form factors, their horn paths are most likely to also be different.

The discussion is based on the info from the sales page. It’s hard enough coming to the forum for the first time and making a sub cab build decision without being befuddled by technical jargon one may not yet understand, so, in the case of the T30 vs T45, the decision isn’t so much on response, but form factor that suits, and one can expect much the same response from either.

I see the same with AT, TAT, and TruckT on the sales page, “similar” when discussing response at a base level.
If your building for a car, choose AT, TAT for a van say, or TruckT for a truck. Form factor is the decider.

While it may say similar on the sales page, it does say virtually identical in the SPL charts section...
Built:
DR 250: x 2 melded array, 2x CD horn, March 2012 plans.
T39's: 4 x 20" KL3010LF , 2 x 28" 3012LF.
WH8: x 6 with melded array wired series/parallel.
Bunter's Audio and Lighting "like"s would be most appreciated...

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Bill Fitzmaurice
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#5 Post by Bill Fitzmaurice »

There's not enough difference between the T30 and T45 to recommend one over the other for any reason other than which shape works best for the intended application.

himhimself
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#6 Post by himhimself »

Ability to v-plate the t30 broke the tie for me...
2xT30 (20", 3012LF)
2xT30 (21", 3012LF)
4xOtop J-array (Beta12, melded/straight piezos)
Truck Tuba (MCM)
Next up: 2xJack12 or family of table tubas

Bruce Weldy
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#7 Post by Bruce Weldy »

I don't have either one, but it seems that it would be way easier to move the T45 on casters than the T30. It's just a bit short for me. But then, I'm old and don't like bending over very far.

6 - T39 3012LF
4 - OT12 2512
1 - T24
1 - SLA Pro
2 - XF210


"A system with a few knobs set up by someone who knows what they are doing is always better than one with a lot of knobs set up by someone who doesn't."

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Seth
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#8 Post by Seth »

Bill Fitzmaurice wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 8:51 am There's not enough difference between the T30 and T45 to recommend one over the other for any reason...
Does a max width T45 closely match a max width T30?

or

Does a 24" T45 closely match a 24" T30?

And

Does V-plating a T30 give it an advantage or not?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

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Seth
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#9 Post by Seth »

Bruce Weldy wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:53 am I don't have either one, but it seems that it would be way easier to move the T45 on casters than the T30. It's just a bit short for me. But then, I'm old and don't like bending over very far.
That's certainly a valuable consideration and I agree. Seems it would be much handier to cart the T45 around. And I'm leaning that direction. But, being as the drivers I intend to use have limited Vd in comparison to the premium drivers, I'd give strong consideration to passing on the convenience factor in favor of a few dB at the high pass frequency if it were available.
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

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Seth
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Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#10 Post by Seth »

himhimself wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:20 am Ability to v-plate the t30 broke the tie for me...
Can you tell the difference, with and without?
Build in process - 2 WH6, one Alpha 6a loaded, one PRV Audio 6MB250-NDY loaded

Two 2x6 shorty SLA Pro's
One T39, 16", 3012LF loaded
Tall AutoTuba, 20" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421
TruckTuba, 8½" wide, 2x 8" MCM 55-2421

himhimself
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Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:34 pm
Location: Vancouver BC & Bloomington IN

Re: Tuba 30 vs. Tuba 45

#11 Post by himhimself »

Seth, I've honestly never a-b'd with and without the v-plate. I ran them once without right after I finished the build, but have run them with the v-plate ever since. I end up using the v-plate as a platform for my amp rack and mixer so it serves a dual purpose. Since I've bridged my one of my old Crown amps into the pair at about 50v, they are stunning indoors. And still really good outside, but at some point I'll make another pair. Then I'll have a v-plated stack of four which should be great outside.
2xT30 (20", 3012LF)
2xT30 (21", 3012LF)
4xOtop J-array (Beta12, melded/straight piezos)
Truck Tuba (MCM)
Next up: 2xJack12 or family of table tubas

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