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 Post subject: More kick?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:34 pm
Posts: 432
Location: Tampa, FL
I used a pair of T24 double BP loaded on 1 channel, 2 x SLA Pro full cab 7' high on trip pods. updated plans for T39 20" 3012LF (I have 2 still in the box seating 2 years now)
Was thinking : 6 x T39 20" wide 2 amps Crest 7001 4subs stereo 4 ohm, 2 subs 1 channel 4ohm
: 2 x Jack 212 (3012HO) 2 Faital 10AK with diffuser wooden horn 1 amp QSC CX 502 500 watt 4 ohm.
OR : 2 x OTop 212(3012HO) 2 Faital 10AK with diffuser wooden horn 1 amp QSC CX 502 500 watt 4 ohm.

Electronics: Pioneer DJ Mixer, Turntables 1200, Apple Laptop
: Prestine Factory refurbished Ashly XR2001 3 way crossover
: New DBX iEQ15
: 2 x Crest 7001 amps
: 1 x QSC CX502 amp
2 Way set up passive 1" CD's

Wedding 6/24= 320 venue 150' long rectangular room 30' high ceilings a stage and wooden floor. 30-50 on the dance floor most of the night.

End of the night complains "we couldn't hear your music" Granny was seated in the back and most close friends and relatives.
Groom= Great music here's something for you $20 oh boy! Gas money for my truck LOL.
I have other speakers I used this setup because the bride assured me that most of her guest don't dance. I told her ok won't blast them then.
The T24's couldn't keep up so I was thinking this lighter set up and quick plus I have 4 sheets of 1/2" BB and 1 3/4" Arauco Home Depot.
The double 12's would have better kick freq (75Hz-150Hz) no EQ.

Well what do you think guys? Thanks for the help! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: More kick?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:58 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 7:00 pm
Posts: 238
Location: Authorized BF Builder - Indy
The last wedding I did (I avoid them at all costs normally) I was in a similar sized hall, though my floors were tile covered concrete and there was no stage. I ran only a couple of 20" T39's, wall loaded, and two OT12's and I had people dancing at the other end of the building.

-PC Laptop
-XAir18
-DR260
-2-QSC GX5's

Zero sound complaints and a ton of compliments.

Worked in an open barn as well, though I was using T39 slims and a couple of J12's for that one. That dance floor was 30ft from the cabinets and still people complimented, got drunk and shook booty.

Having said that, the one thing I've learned of weddings is that when someone tells you that people won't dance, do not believe them.

Not . for . one . minute.

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 Post subject: Re: More kick?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 4:10 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:34 pm
Posts: 432
Location: Tampa, FL
For sure James, I have done weddings and sweet sixteens and corporate or back yard parties I try and sense how the guests are when I see someone or a group starts dancing by my second track this generally gives an idea what type of music this crowd want to hear also by requests too.

Anyway I need a new light small system that will kick (bass kick) to penetrate the crowd, I also don't play much Hip Hop only when requested or reggae so i don't need to go down to 20Hz. I think this will be my next system build I have other DIY JBL double 15's 2226H loaded and other tops but I think this will be a more scaleable system and small but potent.

Any ideas! 8)

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 Post subject: Re: More kick?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 5:08 am
Posts: 5343
Location: Warren, MI
djlivex wrote:
Any ideas! ... 2 x SLA Pro full cab 7' high... 30' high ceilings


Your 1st problems are the height of the SLA and the 30' high ceilings. The bottom driver of the SLA Pro should be around ear height of a standing person, so I would put the bottom of the cab around 60" or so. 2 of any sub would not cut it in a room of that size. Think of it as trying to provide sound to a "normal" room that is over 3X the size of the one you were in.

IIRC, you have 1 pair of OTop 112s. Add at least a 2nd pair. I don't know why you are so insistent on using compression horns, but to each his own. However, stop thinking you need 2x12s! Build singles. This makes your system way more modular, like making spiral arrays for outdoor, "super-wide" dispersion. But, I would HIGHLY recommend that you build the OTop 12 J-Array singles from here on out, to add on to your currents. Forget about the Jacks. They are an "all-in-one" design. You will always use subs, so Jack 12s are not as good of a choice as OTop 12s, in your situation. Keep the SLAs around, they will be handy when you do small, house/backyard parties.

As for subs, T39 absolutely beat the shit out of T24s. They are a little larger to transport and store, but a pair of single 3012LF loaded T39s will beat the snot out of your dual BP102-loaded T24s, SOUNDLY. Make your 1st pair maybe 20"-24" wide, make your 2nd and subsequent pairs 28"-30" wide, for maximum SPL per cab.



I would urge you to sell the Ashly crossover and the dBx iEQ-15, and pick up a true DSP, such as the dBx Driverack series, the Ashly Protea series, or the Behringer/Midas DCX-2496 and DEQ-2496. All of these options, except the Ashly, will cost a lot less than the iEQ-15, and do so much more in a single space design, with the exception of the DCX/DEQ combo, which are each a single space. This is still half the space the Ashly and the dBx iEQ will take up.

djlivex wrote:
The double 12's would have better kick freq (75Hz-150Hz) no EQ.


This statement leads me to believe you are crossing from your subs to your tops at around 150Hz? Your subs should be handling below 100Hz. If your tops are 80Hz capable, lower the crossover frequency to 80-90Hz. Use relatively steep slopes, at least 24dB/oct. I prefer much steeper slopes, at a higher frequency (LR 48dB/oct @ 100Hz), but experiment with the type and slope until you like what you hear at the crossover point. And you MUST ALWAYS EQ YOUR SYSTEM TO EACH VENUE! Even if you return to the same venue, unless your set-up is exactly the same, you will need to EQ to the venue again. This is, again, why the DSP rule over the analog crossover and EQ.

We give you options, opinions and suggestions, but you rarely take them, and go off on some tangent. Does the Ashly provide a hard-knee limiter, or an easily adjustable high- and low-pass frequency, slope and type of crossover? From what I've read online, the answer is a resounding "NO".

djlivex wrote:
plus I have 4 sheets of 1/2" BB and 1 3/4" Arauco


Use the 3/4" Arauco for something else. The 4 Sheets of BB should be enough for 4 OTop 12 J-Arrays or 2 T39s. You will need more BB. There is a shop in Tampa that stocks/sells BB, Craftsman Supply Center, 5011 E Busch Blvd, Tampa, FL 33617, (813) 988-4677. But, they are quite expensive for 1/2" 5'x5' BB is US$44.50 a sheet! :shock: But, You could use less expensive 1/2" plywood for the interior panels, and your BB for the exterior.

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I know money often seals the deal, but seriously, quality is an investment, not an expense... Grant Bunter
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 Post subject: Re: More kick?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 6:14 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:34 pm
Posts: 432
Location: Tampa, FL
I'll fill you in on the project once it is being cut I think a 212 OTop will fill my need just fine I bought the Ashly and DBX iQ15 to reflect on back to old school of the 80's Analog sound . It'll be back to turntables for me and no more controllers or CDJ players for me. Hope to get also plots with a mic for real measurements on my endeavor.

Thanks Phatman! :wink:

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